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Hello everybody, Richard Hart here with Paul Sztorc.

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You pronounced it right, that's amazing, you pronounced it right without asking me
beforehand.

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How did you do that?

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I've been in the space for a while.

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You've been in the space for a while.

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Is that one of your special powers as a vampire, you can, you know how, are you,
have you taken,

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you've taken a human form for this conversation I assume?

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I've even turned on the main lights, I'm wearing a lot of sunscreen with the main
lights

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on to convince people I'm actually human, so it's a trick I do.

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Good.

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I'm sorry that, guys, I don't have Wi-Fi, I've tried to get it very hard today, but

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this wasn't in the cards, so you can't see me probably.

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Yeah, Paul's not where he normally is, so he's got crappy internet, so we're doing
it

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with his voice and my face, sorry for you guys.

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Voice only.

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The good news is Paul's smarter than me, so you guys should be able to learn
something.

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I should be able to learn something too.

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So give me a...

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I would help him learn something too, I don't know, I don't really know anything
about,

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I only know a few things about hex, so I'm happy to learn, personally.

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Well, I thought we were going to talk about Bitcoin scaling, I don't even know what
you

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want to talk about.

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You know, you just kind of threw that in, he threw that in, dear audience members,
he

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just kind of threw that in, the title, he didn't even, you know...

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We didn't have a plan.

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I thought we were going to talk about blockchain scaling, because I think it is
actually pretty

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interesting.

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Sure.

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We can talk about whatever you want, man.

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And my audience has already heard enough about hex for a while, I mean, let's talk
about

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some Bitcoin stuff, if it's okay with you, unless you get...

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It helps to try to compare blockchain to the Lightning Network, so actually that's
kind

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of like one of my favorite ways of explaining it.

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Well, hold on, don't do that yet, let me tell everyone who you are.

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So you're a professor, aren't you?

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No, that's not really the case, but I did work as a researcher, which is sort of
what

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really professors want to spend all their time doing.

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Academia is very complicated, but yeah, I have a background in academia, and I did
work

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as a statistician in the Yale Economics Department.

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All right, so working at Yale isn't too bad, right?

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Not bad, not bad at all.

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And then you've been trying to get sidechains as a way to add throughput and
features to

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Bitcoin for how many years now?

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Well, yeah, I originally published this blog post in November 20, oh, I don't even
know,

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2015?

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Yes.

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So it's been about four solid years, although, of course, I wasn't working on
Drivechain

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for a lot of that time.

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I had my own project, which is called Bitcoin Hivemind now, and that is a prediction
markets

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project that I was originally working on, and it was going to be a sidechain.

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And at the time, I thought, when I was working on that, which is 2013, 2014, 2015,
2016 a

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little bit, and still ongoing, I still work on it.

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When I was working on that, I assumed that someone else, especially Blockstream, but

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maybe another dark horse person or rootstock or someone would invent the sidechains
connecting

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tissue.

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But then it eventually became clear that no one was going to do that.

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And especially when I started to work on Drivechain, it became clear that there were
a lot

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of extremely bizarre ideas and sort of perspectives on how people thought it would
have to work

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or the criteria that people thought it would have to meet.

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So before you get too deep, how do you know that it's clear that they wouldn't do
it?

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Well, I was just like, I thought the original sidechains white paper from
Blockstream, that

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was October 2014, if I remember correctly.

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So that's just a long time between October 2014, November 2015, I published
Drivechain,

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and then still in 2016, we basically finished the prediction markets project,
Bitcoin Hivemind.

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You can see, if you go to bitcoinhivemind.com, you can see screenshots that have a
GUI and

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graphs and things.

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So software's never finished.

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Why doesn't anyone want to scale Bitcoin with sidechains?

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Because if they wanted it, they would do it, right?

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I mean, they wrote the first white paper on it, and then it's just been dead for
five

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years?

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No, we have been developing-

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Not you, everyone else.

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And I actually think that it has, I think it's kind of comparable to the Lightning
Network

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in complexity.

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So some people ask us, CryptEx and I, CryptEx really does all the work, I just talk
to people

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on YouTube.

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But I think people ask us like, what's taking so long?

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But that's kind of like the parallel question to the Lightning Network, like what's
taking

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Lightning Network so long?

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I think it's really, it may even be, Drivechain may even be more, it may involve
more

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like debugging than Lightning Network, I don't know about the overall complexity.

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From what I've seen, they don't give a fuck to engage you at all, and they don't
care

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about what you're doing enough to even understand it, to debate you.

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And you can't even get these guys to talk to you, is what I've seen.

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You may have seen my, I have a page, I have a drivechain.info, I have a page, and
then

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I have a part where I say, here's the peer review, especially responding to two
criticisms,

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and you can see-

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That's better.

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Like some criticisms is better than no engagement.

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Yeah.

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You can overcome criticism, you can't overcome silence.

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Obviously I appreciate all criticism.

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Some have, some of these critiques have just persisted for years, despite my
attempts to

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just like completely refute them, like as much as possible.

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I think the critique everyone has is that the sidechain will be insecure due to hash

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things.

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One is that people think that the miners will steal from the sidechain, but that is
really

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the, that would be trivial to prevent.

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I don't know exactly where people are coming from with that, because that is exactly
what

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makes it a sidechain, and what makes it firewalls from you.

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That is your license to not care about anything that happens there.

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If it was impossible, if it was somehow enforced on layer one, which would be
trivial to do.

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Don't the layer two guys just get fucked in that example?

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Excuse me?

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I didn't understand.

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What did you say?

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Well, you're saying that it's a firewall and that you don't care what happens to the
layer

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two guys, because layer one's isolated from it.

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But is there an objection that-

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No, I'm referring to, and I think of sidechains, or specifically, I guess,
Drivechain, I don't

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know what other sidechains are around, but I think of them as a layer two.

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When I say layer two, I mean when you send money to a specific sidechain software,
you

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send something to Rootstock or whatever.

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Let me start from scratch.

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I'm going to go out on a limb and say that sidechains are less secure than the main
chain.

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Would you agree with that?

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Yes.

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It's like layer two, there's an additional, there's a couple of senses in which
they're

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more secure, which is kind of funny.

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And I have a blog post about this, if people are interested, it's-

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You're going to have to do a short version, bro, because you're going to run out of
attention

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span at some point.

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I'll go for eight hours, but you won't.

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But yes, there's an additional, there are more moving parts and more security
assumptions,

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so-

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Okay.

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Well, you've got twice the attack surface, at least, because if the main chain's
fucked,

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you're fucked.

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And then if you're fucked, you're fucked.

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So there's at least twice that.

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And then whatever you did that's new is likely to be less secure than what's been
around

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for 10 years and barely changed, it has more eyeballs on it.

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So then like, so I mean, I would say, and then, I mean, it seems at least two thirds

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less secure to me there, but what are the security assumptions you said were
stronger

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on the sidechain?

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Well, one is that the sidechain is sort of more protected from reorgs because, well,

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the sidechain withdraws specifically because they take so long to go through that no
one

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is going to reorg for like three months and not reorg for less time than that.

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So there are a couple elements of it that are actually-

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Completely over my head.

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What you can do is you can move-

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What the fuck are you talking about?

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And then you can swap with someone else so that you don't actually have to go
through

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the process of-

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Hey, hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on.

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If I don't get it, nobody listening gets it, man.

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So let's get back up a little bit.

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Well, you know, I'm not-

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Reorg.

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I understand exactly what you're saying and I would love to communicate the ideas
better,

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but at the same time, I do often think about how when Satoshi published Bitcoin for
the

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first time, basically everyone hated it and misunderstood it, even on the Cypherpunk
mailing

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list where you think they would be most likely to understand it.

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And after all, this is a Friedrich Hayek kind of world that we should actually think
less

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and less of.

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I don't think what you're saying is complicated.

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I just think that we went over it too quick.

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You're talking about a difference in reorgs.

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So a reorg is when there's a certain chain that everyone believes in and then you
go,

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oh, actually, hey, I found this other chain that has more hash weight or a higher
block

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height and so we're just going to say that that's the authoritative chain, orphan
that

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other thing, fork it away, it's gone now, and we just rewrote history basically.

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That's what a reorg is, right?

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Yes.

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Okay.

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So now everyone knows what a reorg is.

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We went down the chain a little bit and then we said, hey, fuck it, actually, we're
going

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to go back in time and we're going to make it as though we went this other way
instead.

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It requires mining effort to like, you're like cutting it, you're like digging a
ditch.

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It happens all the time, but to a lower block density.

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It's a new canal, so it takes more effort.

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Right.

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It happens all the time, but it just doesn't happen very deep.

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For a withdrawal, they're intentionally very, very, very slow.

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So there's really no...

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You're talking about on the sidechain you're talking about.

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Yes.

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It comes back from the sidechain to the main chain.

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But again, as you say, I don't know.

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So we won't get into the security trade-offs of the difference between a reorg on a
main

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chain and a reorg.

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I just want to say there's many, you know, with Lightning, there's many, and with
DroneChain,

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there's many, and with all kinds of things there are.

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I tried to promote the shit out of your project a couple of years ago, and no one
gave a fuck.

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Oh, thank you.

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Because I wanted to see a lot of good things happen on Bitcoin, because I saw
Ethereum

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and all the new money with their ERC20 tokens, where anyone could start a ticker
symbol and

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go raise a zillion dollars with a ticker symbol and a dream.

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And they were getting all that money, and then Bitcoin wasn't getting any of it,
because

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you couldn't put a ticker symbol on Bitcoin.

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And it was the easiest thing you could think of to add.

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We just need ticker symbols, man.

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That's where all the money is.

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Can we have that?

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Well, hindsight is 20-20.

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But yeah, certainly I think that, I mean, Bitcoin, you could have done it.

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There were projects, as you know.

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00:10:57,240 --> 00:11:02,080
Well, yeah, Counterparty and Omni, and now there's a fork of Bitcoin called Raven
that

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does ticker symbols.

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Exactly, right.

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Because we fucking need these things.

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No, the sidechains were supposed to be, originally, a long time ago, this is like
2014, possibly

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even, maybe even December 2013, if you go to IRC chat or something, this was
supposed

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to be the response to these new ideas.

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The history of Bitcoin is like, Bitcoin came out, it was super new and impressive,
and

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people started making copies of it that were really just quite just terrible, or
just at

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least not very creative, something with Litecoin, where it was just a copy-paste.

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And so it's kind of sort of insultingly simple.

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The marginal effort was zero compared to the effort that Satoshi put in to make it
from

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a blank piece of paper.

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By then, though, in 2014, you did have things.

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I mean, people like to tell this story where Ethereum was a success and Bitcoin
should

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have been on top of it.

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And there's some truth in that.

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You're saying Ethereum should have been on top of Bitcoin?

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No, no, no.

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I mean, people want to get, they want to buy into that story, that was the sense in
which

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I mean, that people want to get, they want to get, they would like to take that
point

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of view.

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That Ethereum is more successful than Bitcoin?

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No, that Ethereum had some useful things to offer.

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Okay.

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Well, it does.

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I know that it does.

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Right.

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Well, a lot of people feel that way, but I just want to bring up that there's a
little

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bit of...

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Feel that way?

230
00:12:31,120 --> 00:12:32,120
What?

231
00:12:32,120 --> 00:12:33,120
Well, there's a little bit of survivor bias, because...

232
00:12:33,120 --> 00:12:37,120
Dog, we have this argument right now, this is an easy one.

233
00:12:37,120 --> 00:12:39,120
Ethereum beats the fuck out of Bitcoin.

234
00:12:39,120 --> 00:12:40,120
Badly.

235
00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:41,120
Do you understand what I'm talking about, though?

236
00:12:41,120 --> 00:12:43,320
The point I'm trying to make is that...

237
00:12:43,320 --> 00:12:48,440
I mean, it sounds to me like the point you're trying to make is that everyone
thought Bitcoin

238
00:12:48,440 --> 00:12:52,800
was going to be the programmable money, and then everyone that tried to program on
top

239
00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:57,680
of it got ass-fucked, like Counterparty, when they changed the opcode size, like
Omni, which

240
00:12:57,680 --> 00:13:00,080
trades less than $300 a day now.

241
00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:04,360
And so there's two companies that tried to build on top of Bitcoin, they failed
entirely.

242
00:13:04,360 --> 00:13:05,360
Now there's a...

243
00:13:05,360 --> 00:13:06,360
Go ahead.

244
00:13:06,360 --> 00:13:12,280
Yes, you raised some good points, but I think it's really not so much the opcode
change,

245
00:13:12,280 --> 00:13:14,080
it's really more the culture.

246
00:13:14,080 --> 00:13:15,880
That, I agree, I agree.

247
00:13:15,880 --> 00:13:17,880
They don't want people building on their shit.

248
00:13:17,880 --> 00:13:27,760
And it did, in fact, obviously, survive the opcode data bytes shortening.

249
00:13:27,760 --> 00:13:32,800
So that's really not that, it's really more the culture of who is...

250
00:13:32,800 --> 00:13:36,440
They don't want to fork your shit in there, and they don't want to work with you,
and

251
00:13:36,440 --> 00:13:40,080
they don't want to change anything, and they don't want you building on top of
Bitcoin.

252
00:13:40,080 --> 00:13:41,080
And they're only letting...

253
00:13:41,080 --> 00:13:46,920
It's especially ironic with mine, because mine is sort of itself the escape hatch
that

254
00:13:46,920 --> 00:13:54,320
would let new software on without existing Bitcoin Core developers being able to
veto

255
00:13:54,320 --> 00:13:55,600
it at all.

256
00:13:55,600 --> 00:14:01,920
So mine is like the sort of the one, it's just the one thing you need to get all of

257
00:14:01,920 --> 00:14:07,560
that stuff back using BTC, but not on layer one.

258
00:14:07,560 --> 00:14:10,920
I think that's a total fucking waste of time, and I used to not.

259
00:14:10,920 --> 00:14:12,560
And here's my belief on that.

260
00:14:12,560 --> 00:14:19,120
So it used to be the case that everyone thought Bitcoin was the most secure, and
they probably

261
00:14:19,120 --> 00:14:21,360
still do think Bitcoin's the most secure.

262
00:14:21,360 --> 00:14:25,760
But when you objectively measure it, and you see which network has had more
failures, and

263
00:14:25,760 --> 00:14:30,720
which network has a worse mining ecosystem, and which network is less likely to make
progress,

264
00:14:30,720 --> 00:14:35,720
and less likely to get consensus to roll in any improvements, Bitcoin is terrible
compared

265
00:14:35,720 --> 00:14:36,960
to Ethereum.

266
00:14:36,960 --> 00:14:40,640
So ASIC mining is 65% in China.

267
00:14:40,640 --> 00:14:43,640
You can't mine on the network to defend it if you wanted to.

268
00:14:43,640 --> 00:14:48,480
But on Ethereum, you can be a GPU guy, and a hobbyist, and start mining, and freeing

269
00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:51,600
them on board, but you can't Bitcoin.

270
00:14:51,600 --> 00:14:56,560
And how many forks has Ethereum had rolling out new improvements and becoming a
better

271
00:14:56,560 --> 00:14:57,560
network?

272
00:14:57,560 --> 00:15:02,080
And Bitcoin has had nothing since SegWit two years ago, just incremental maintenance
upgrades,

273
00:15:02,080 --> 00:15:04,000
no feature upgrades whatsoever.

274
00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:06,560
They won't even engage with you, a guy that's been trying to improve the product for
four

275
00:15:06,560 --> 00:15:08,220
or five years.

276
00:15:08,220 --> 00:15:11,980
Everyone that used to work on Bitcoin is now making money on things that aren't
Bitcoin.

277
00:15:11,980 --> 00:15:13,500
They're working on Lightning instead.

278
00:15:13,500 --> 00:15:15,220
They're working on Liquid instead.

279
00:15:15,220 --> 00:15:18,060
They're doing everything else instead.

280
00:15:18,060 --> 00:15:21,660
And the history of the security is actually fraudulent.

281
00:15:21,660 --> 00:15:25,220
Bitcoin has had two inflation bugs, which is the worst bug you can possibly have.

282
00:15:25,220 --> 00:15:29,080
And it's spaghetti code that's not modular, and there's no bug bounty program.

283
00:15:29,080 --> 00:15:33,500
And so what good thing, why the fuck would anyone build on top of Bitcoin instead of

284
00:15:33,500 --> 00:15:34,500
Ethereum?

285
00:15:34,500 --> 00:15:35,500
That was a lot of points.

286
00:15:35,740 --> 00:15:42,180
OK, so first of all, I do think that Bitcoin's technology is superior to Ethereum's,
and

287
00:15:42,180 --> 00:15:49,740
we see that Ethereum's lack of foresight kind of is coming out in various ways with
problems,

288
00:15:49,740 --> 00:15:52,740
running nodes and centralization.

289
00:15:52,740 --> 00:15:56,060
That story has been told many times, and you did make many points here.

290
00:15:56,060 --> 00:15:57,060
Let me see.

291
00:15:57,060 --> 00:15:59,780
I can go slow and just list them again, because it's important.

292
00:15:59,860 --> 00:16:05,820
I think one thing to point out is that it shouldn't really matter with the whole
point

293
00:16:05,820 --> 00:16:11,500
of sidechains and with Drivechain and really with open source philosophy in general
and

294
00:16:11,500 --> 00:16:19,060
really Friedrich Hayek or Karl Popper kind of philosophy on life is that it
shouldn't

295
00:16:19,060 --> 00:16:24,180
really matter who's right or wrong as long as we have a path toward deleting the
mistakes

296
00:16:24,180 --> 00:16:26,460
and making ongoing progress.

297
00:16:26,460 --> 00:16:29,020
So it's kind of neat that Drivechain...

298
00:16:29,020 --> 00:16:30,020
There's a lot of friction.

299
00:16:30,020 --> 00:16:35,940
Whether you believe that Ethereum is better than Bitcoin Core or whether you think
Bitcoin

300
00:16:35,940 --> 00:16:40,100
Cash is better than either or whatever you believe, you can use whichever software
you

301
00:16:40,100 --> 00:16:41,100
like.

302
00:16:41,100 --> 00:16:42,580
It's the same 21 million coins.

303
00:16:42,580 --> 00:16:46,380
I don't agree with anything you just said.

304
00:16:46,380 --> 00:16:48,700
I don't agree with any of that.

305
00:16:48,700 --> 00:16:49,700
OK.

306
00:16:49,700 --> 00:16:51,380
So you're ignoring that friction exists.

307
00:16:51,380 --> 00:16:57,980
So you're making this binary selection, false choice that libertarians tend to make,
which

308
00:16:57,980 --> 00:17:00,780
is OK, survival of the fittest.

309
00:17:00,780 --> 00:17:04,620
And so we'll just try everything and then whatever works is what we'll stick with.

310
00:17:04,620 --> 00:17:08,660
And if that shit worked, then every neural net in the stock market would just make
infinite

311
00:17:08,660 --> 00:17:09,660
money.

312
00:17:09,660 --> 00:17:14,580
But it turns out that your ability to experiment is restricted by some input
resource and you

313
00:17:14,580 --> 00:17:18,660
run out of input resource after you run so many experiments.

314
00:17:18,660 --> 00:17:21,380
And so you have finite time to build stuff.

315
00:17:21,380 --> 00:17:23,140
You have finite places to try it out.

316
00:17:23,140 --> 00:17:26,660
You have finite mind share to try and get people to adopt it.

317
00:17:26,660 --> 00:17:30,060
And if you fail any one of those things, your whole project fails.

318
00:17:30,060 --> 00:17:31,060
You have to get them all right.

319
00:17:31,060 --> 00:17:32,060
I agree with that.

320
00:17:32,060 --> 00:17:33,060
I think that's great.

321
00:17:33,060 --> 00:17:37,980
But it's not particularly relevant in this case because we have the finite input
that

322
00:17:37,980 --> 00:17:40,340
you point out, which is absolutely the case.

323
00:17:40,340 --> 00:17:43,940
But in our case, finite though it is, it has already produced this.

324
00:17:43,940 --> 00:17:48,740
It has already produced Ethereum, it has already produced it shares, it has already
produced

325
00:17:48,740 --> 00:17:49,740
Ravencoin.

326
00:17:49,740 --> 00:17:53,540
Do you think it's useful for people to know that Ethereum has never had an inflation
bug,

327
00:17:53,540 --> 00:17:54,540
but Bitcoin's had two?

328
00:17:55,260 --> 00:17:58,100
Well, you know, that was on your earlier list, so you have to let me get through all
of your

329
00:17:58,100 --> 00:17:59,100
I don't mind.

330
00:17:59,100 --> 00:18:00,100
I'm not trying to.

331
00:18:00,100 --> 00:18:01,780
I'm not trying to skip past anything, bro.

332
00:18:01,780 --> 00:18:03,380
I want to learn.

333
00:18:03,380 --> 00:18:07,780
You are saying about this creativity is finite, and I agree.

334
00:18:07,780 --> 00:18:10,980
And that is neural nets do not have insufficient creativity.

335
00:18:10,980 --> 00:18:12,820
And I completely agree with that.

336
00:18:12,820 --> 00:18:17,020
So this is though survival of the fittest in a case where many of the things have
already

337
00:18:17,020 --> 00:18:18,060
been created.

338
00:18:18,060 --> 00:18:21,820
So not only we don't, I'm not going to say we don't need creativity in this case
because

339
00:18:21,820 --> 00:18:23,620
we always need it wherever we can get it.

340
00:18:23,700 --> 00:18:27,180
But someone has already produced Zcash.

341
00:18:27,180 --> 00:18:31,940
So we didn't have to have someone think of it and think of how do we do the...

342
00:18:31,940 --> 00:18:33,140
My position is this.

343
00:18:33,140 --> 00:18:36,180
I think if other people do what you did and try and build on Bitcoin, they'll suffer
the

344
00:18:36,180 --> 00:18:38,940
same fate that you did and waste four years of your life.

345
00:18:38,940 --> 00:18:41,180
If you would have built that shit on Ethereum, it would have already been done and
rolled

346
00:18:41,180 --> 00:18:42,180
out.

347
00:18:42,180 --> 00:18:45,340
This is another thing that, well, you know, as soon as I finish with Ethereum,
they're

348
00:18:45,340 --> 00:18:49,180
going to steal it and call it sharding and say it was their idea the whole time.

349
00:18:49,180 --> 00:18:50,180
So whatever.

350
00:18:50,180 --> 00:18:51,180
That's fine.

351
00:18:51,180 --> 00:18:52,180
They can do that if they want.

352
00:18:52,180 --> 00:18:53,180
That's fine.

353
00:18:53,740 --> 00:18:54,740
That's the idea.

354
00:18:54,740 --> 00:18:55,740
Do you want them to do that?

355
00:18:55,740 --> 00:18:56,740
I agree.

356
00:18:56,740 --> 00:18:57,740
Yeah.

357
00:18:57,740 --> 00:19:00,780
No, I say I have to say something else, though, which is that it's not true that
I've been

358
00:19:00,780 --> 00:19:04,300
just totally like kicked out of Bitcoin core discussions.

359
00:19:04,300 --> 00:19:10,100
In fact, earlier this year, I was invited to Austin BitDevs to give a talk about
sidechaining.

360
00:19:10,100 --> 00:19:11,180
You should be.

361
00:19:11,180 --> 00:19:12,180
You're one of the few guys trying.

362
00:19:12,180 --> 00:19:15,580
You're one of the few guys trying to add features to Bitcoin.

363
00:19:15,580 --> 00:19:17,940
We're still refining and debugging the software.

364
00:19:17,940 --> 00:19:22,760
So that's my number one priority is to make sure that I'm testing the software and
making

365
00:19:22,760 --> 00:19:24,280
sure that it is.

366
00:19:24,280 --> 00:19:28,760
So it's not even though the idea was really finished and has not changed very much
since

367
00:19:28,760 --> 00:19:36,880
November 2015, the actual software obviously has changed substantially.

368
00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:42,800
And that is there's a lot, you know, the details matter a lot, as you know, and as
everyone

369
00:19:42,800 --> 00:19:46,120
who touches software knows, it takes much longer than you anticipate.

370
00:19:46,120 --> 00:19:50,760
You know, and, you know, I don't know you guys in the audience, you don't know how
little

371
00:19:50,760 --> 00:19:55,320
effort I'm really putting in traveling around the world and doing whatever I want to
do.

372
00:19:55,320 --> 00:20:00,120
I think if you care a lot about this problem, about this problem that people
disagree about

373
00:20:00,120 --> 00:20:06,080
what their blockchain software should do, and there's no clear way to resolve
disputes

374
00:20:06,080 --> 00:20:10,360
over what's too ambitious to change and what isn't, then I think, yeah, a lot of
people

375
00:20:10,360 --> 00:20:13,000
should be signing up to volunteer and help.

376
00:20:13,000 --> 00:20:17,640
But at the same time, I realize it's confusing.

377
00:20:17,640 --> 00:20:19,920
But I do want to say that it's not completely the case.

378
00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:23,600
A lot of people are supporters.

379
00:20:23,600 --> 00:20:31,760
And it's some many extremely influential people at Blockstream and at Lightning in
the Lightning

380
00:20:31,760 --> 00:20:38,440
community are some of the biggest supporters, which is very funny and ironic and
often kind

381
00:20:38,440 --> 00:20:39,440
of overlooked.

382
00:20:39,440 --> 00:20:42,080
You're going to throw any money into Blockstream cloud mining?

383
00:20:42,080 --> 00:20:46,080
No, I'm sorry, what did you say?

384
00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:48,640
I'm not going to put any money in cloud mining.

385
00:20:48,640 --> 00:20:49,640
Blockstream cloud mining.

386
00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:50,640
You're going to throw any money into it?

387
00:20:50,640 --> 00:20:55,640
I personally, well, in mining, you know, as someone with a little bit of experience
in

388
00:20:55,640 --> 00:20:59,960
economic theory, you know, mining is that's such a brutally competitive thing.

389
00:20:59,960 --> 00:21:02,760
You can't do that unless you have some kind of edge that no one else...

390
00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:04,440
I'm being snarky, but you're missing it.

391
00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:06,240
I'm not trying to actually talk about mining.

392
00:21:06,240 --> 00:21:08,240
I'm trying to talk about centralization.

393
00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:15,160
I don't like that Blockstream has liquid and cloud mining and an ICO launching
platform

394
00:21:15,160 --> 00:21:18,480
and is in charge of the Bitcoin core repository.

395
00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:19,480
I don't like that.

396
00:21:19,480 --> 00:21:23,080
Well, they were afraid, you know, they built a lot of things they were afraid that
other

397
00:21:23,080 --> 00:21:24,080
people had.

398
00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:25,080
They built themselves.

399
00:21:25,080 --> 00:21:26,080
They compete.

400
00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:32,200
One thing where I think is a critique of Blockstream that, well, I have two
critiques of Blockstream

401
00:21:32,200 --> 00:21:34,200
that people don't make a lot.

402
00:21:34,200 --> 00:21:38,640
One is really how little they actually do, considering all the people that they have

403
00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:43,160
hired or have worked there for so long and all the money they have, they really
don't

404
00:21:43,160 --> 00:21:44,360
produce very much.

405
00:21:44,360 --> 00:21:47,880
But the second critique I would make that a lot of people don't make is this
cultural

406
00:21:47,920 --> 00:21:50,560
direction, which, again, is much more important.

407
00:21:50,560 --> 00:21:57,040
What's in people's minds is much more important than any formal governance
institution.

408
00:21:57,040 --> 00:21:58,040
Sure.

409
00:21:58,040 --> 00:22:03,320
We have speed limits in the United States, but we also have rules about on the
highway,

410
00:22:03,320 --> 00:22:10,080
you can go five or seven or ten maybe miles above it if everyone else is.

411
00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:12,880
You know, in other countries, there are totally different rules about how to drive.

412
00:22:12,880 --> 00:22:13,880
You see some of these videos.

413
00:22:13,880 --> 00:22:14,880
They're very funny.

414
00:22:14,880 --> 00:22:15,880
Yeah.

415
00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:24,520
So what's in people's mind is really important, and that is one place where if
employees from

416
00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:31,480
Blockstream, just one or two of them say that the project might not be good for
whatever

417
00:22:31,480 --> 00:22:38,440
reason, that is enough to completely obliterate discussion of the project, which is
a real

418
00:22:38,440 --> 00:22:42,200
threat that people don't talk about.

419
00:22:42,200 --> 00:22:45,200
So here's this dilemma, right?

420
00:22:45,200 --> 00:22:46,800
It's an open source project.

421
00:22:46,800 --> 00:22:51,440
If you don't like what someone's doing, shut the fuck up and do a better job
yourself because

422
00:22:51,440 --> 00:22:52,440
that's how it works, right?

423
00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:55,560
So on one side, I'm like, yeah, let them do whatever they want.

424
00:22:55,560 --> 00:22:56,560
They're a company.

425
00:22:56,560 --> 00:22:57,560
They need to eat.

426
00:22:57,560 --> 00:22:58,560
They need to make money.

427
00:22:58,560 --> 00:22:59,560
Let them do whatever they want.

428
00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:00,560
Stop shit talking.

429
00:23:00,560 --> 00:23:01,560
I feel that on one side.

430
00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:08,520
And on the other side, it's like they decided to reap the rewards of representing
like they

431
00:23:08,520 --> 00:23:11,600
ran shit and kind of do run shit.

432
00:23:11,600 --> 00:23:14,920
And so since if you're going to reap the rewards of acting like running shit and
then actually

433
00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:19,800
run shit, well, then people are going to look to you to be responsible with that
position.

434
00:23:19,800 --> 00:23:25,320
So I'm kind of torn on whether to ream them a new asshole or to just let them do
stupid

435
00:23:25,320 --> 00:23:27,160
things.

436
00:23:27,160 --> 00:23:28,160
I don't know.

437
00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:29,520
I don't know what's best for the world.

438
00:23:29,520 --> 00:23:30,520
Like I.

439
00:23:30,520 --> 00:23:31,520
Yeah.

440
00:23:31,520 --> 00:23:35,880
I mean, they've evolved into a kind of a weird place because they have evolved a lot
of prestige

441
00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:38,440
that they kind of didn't want.

442
00:23:38,440 --> 00:23:41,960
But then they did want it in order to defeat SegWit2x and then they were like, but
we

443
00:23:41,960 --> 00:23:43,240
never really wanted it.

444
00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:44,240
Right.

445
00:23:44,560 --> 00:23:45,560
And now they're in a weird spot.

446
00:23:45,560 --> 00:23:47,440
They are in a really weird spot.

447
00:23:47,440 --> 00:23:50,160
And there's tremendous diversity at Blockstream.

448
00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:54,040
There are many people that I think are just the best, absolute best people.

449
00:23:54,040 --> 00:23:58,520
And there's other people who are like, well, many people have left also, but there's
a

450
00:23:58,520 --> 00:23:59,520
lot of turnover.

451
00:23:59,520 --> 00:24:00,520
A lot of people have quit.

452
00:24:00,520 --> 00:24:02,160
People have been let go again.

453
00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:06,800
I think some of the people who let go is I was amazed they ever got within 100 miles

454
00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:08,400
of the front door in the first place.

455
00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:11,760
And other people who were let go, I'm just like, why were they let go?

456
00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:14,400
So, you know, I don't know.

457
00:24:14,400 --> 00:24:18,520
I mean, look, from my perspective, I think they have an absolutely abysmal business
model

458
00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:21,560
and that it was a bad business to start in the first place.

459
00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:26,200
So it's weird to do corporate analysis when we're talking about open source stuff,
but

460
00:24:26,200 --> 00:24:29,600
since they have so much control over the project and so much say in the space, I
think it's

461
00:24:29,600 --> 00:24:31,320
worth our time.

462
00:24:31,320 --> 00:24:32,320
If you start a business.

463
00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:33,320
I don't really want to.

464
00:24:33,320 --> 00:24:39,000
It's like, as I say, the critique I think I would make is that they don't actually
do

465
00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:40,000
very much.

466
00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:46,760
I think they acquired Green Wallet or Green, I think it was the company was Green
Wallet,

467
00:24:46,760 --> 00:24:47,760
I think.

468
00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:48,760
Or was the company Green Address?

469
00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:49,760
I don't know.

470
00:24:49,760 --> 00:24:50,760
Green Address, I believe.

471
00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:54,760
Like, you know, they have great people who are there, who do their own thing, but
they

472
00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:57,760
could do their own thing on their own to do it there, you know, something like
Andrew

473
00:24:57,760 --> 00:24:58,760
Polstrom or something.

474
00:24:58,760 --> 00:24:59,760
So I don't know.

475
00:25:00,253 --> 00:25:27,253
Like, I think, I do think their presence is kind of a distraction. But also, I feel
like if they're not producing code, they're just in the fucking way, like, would it
set a bad precedent if they just gave up and on the company, but then just reform
something similar, or just shuffled all those people into chain code or something?
Like, what difference? Would it make any difference or make anything better? I don't
think it would make any difference. I mean, developers develop and they just need
paid, but the brand sort of looms.

476
00:25:27,253 --> 00:25:33,573
It just looms in everyone's space. And that is, it's very frightening, because it is
kind of...

477
00:25:34,333 --> 00:25:42,973
It's centralized. It's a central party that has a lot of power. And lately, it
doesn't seem like they're doing good things with it.

478
00:25:42,973 --> 00:25:55,133
Well, it does over the culture. I mean, it's very common to criticize Blockstream
when people really just want to criticize the Bitcoin's stance as being very
conservative about what it lets in.

479
00:25:55,133 --> 00:26:10,653
Although I say that, and then you were talking about the spaghetti code, which I
wanted to react to, because yes, I think that the code in BTC is sort of very high
quality on one hand, but also just like abysmally sane on the other hand.

480
00:26:10,653 --> 00:26:21,973
And in particular, there's one moment that I think is instructive is when they
deleted, you know, main.cpp from the project, but they did so in a way that was
almost like gleeful.

481
00:26:21,973 --> 00:26:27,413
And isn't this funny? Which I think is almost disrespectful to the technical
community.

482
00:26:27,413 --> 00:26:38,293
Obviously, when people learn C++ on day one, they learn that every project has to
have main.cpp and now they're deleting it, which is like this weirdo thing.

483
00:26:38,493 --> 00:26:45,253
Although that comment does not, you know, a lot of these comments do not apply
specifically to Blockstream, as I've been trying to say.

484
00:26:45,253 --> 00:26:48,253
This is a general thing.

485
00:26:48,253 --> 00:27:04,333
I don't want to be hard on them. I'm not like, I lose followers every time I tell
the truth about Bitcoin, every time I tell what's really going on Bitcoin, I lose
followers and it pisses people off because I've got a bag of Bitcoin, they've got a
bag of Bitcoin.

486
00:27:04,853 --> 00:27:07,653
And when you speak the truth about Bitcoin, everyone thinks they're going to lose
money.

487
00:27:08,373 --> 00:27:09,373
So it makes me sad.

488
00:27:10,773 --> 00:27:23,853
But we have evolved a culture of promoting the price of Bitcoin at the expense of
talking about the real world.

489
00:27:23,853 --> 00:27:29,733
And so it has become increasingly kind of gossipy and self-referential.

490
00:27:29,853 --> 00:27:31,773
Yep. And tribal.

491
00:27:31,773 --> 00:27:41,213
If you have a say in the space and you're price positive, then you get to keep your
say.

492
00:27:42,173 --> 00:27:52,733
But as soon as you say something negative about price, like, hey, we might do a bear
market, or if you say, hey, I want these technical decisions to be different, then
you're ostracized and it's like you don't exist anymore.

493
00:27:53,533 --> 00:27:58,093
Which isn't how it doesn't it doesn't keep them intelligent.

494
00:27:58,093 --> 00:27:59,533
It doesn't keep them updated.

495
00:27:59,693 --> 00:28:05,893
They just keep cutting off different information sources until all you're left with
is an echo chamber of meat eating.

496
00:28:06,373 --> 00:28:08,013
You know, like.

497
00:28:09,653 --> 00:28:11,093
Yeah, so it's very challenging.

498
00:28:11,093 --> 00:28:19,293
I mean, you know, at a certain scale, it's challenging to manage everyone's thoughts
and opinions, you know, like you can't discussion has like this.

499
00:28:20,133 --> 00:28:24,333
And squared thing, the more people show up, everyone's got to talk to everyone else,
right?

500
00:28:24,853 --> 00:28:27,973
So what humans have done bars number just one.

501
00:28:28,333 --> 00:28:30,213
Do you want to do you want to talk about hex a bit?

502
00:28:30,213 --> 00:28:34,573
Just because I feel like we're about halfway through, you'll get bored or some shit
or your phone will die or something.

503
00:28:34,693 --> 00:28:36,053
Yeah, well, let's hear about it.

504
00:28:36,053 --> 00:28:37,973
I've heard there's so much drama about it.

505
00:28:37,973 --> 00:28:40,453
This is some kind of like hard fork, but it's not a theorem.

506
00:28:40,493 --> 00:28:41,093
No, you credit.

507
00:28:42,973 --> 00:28:47,333
Yeah, but it is. I know you're not going to say it's a hard fuck, but in my view,
there's not anything that takes to you take so sad.

508
00:28:47,533 --> 00:28:48,613
Oh, OK, then. Sure.

509
00:28:48,733 --> 00:28:51,853
If you believe using UTXO as a fork, then yes, it is.

510
00:28:52,933 --> 00:28:57,293
I think I mean, using Bitcoin's database and who owns which coins.

511
00:28:57,333 --> 00:28:58,533
Sure. Yes, it does use that.

512
00:28:58,653 --> 00:29:00,493
Maybe I'm just revealing how little I know about it.

513
00:29:00,533 --> 00:29:01,373
No, it does. It does.

514
00:29:01,373 --> 00:29:03,933
You know, you made a lot of people talk about it.

515
00:29:03,933 --> 00:29:05,213
So you have the X factor.

516
00:29:05,253 --> 00:29:08,293
Wow. Yeah, they're saying great things.

517
00:29:08,493 --> 00:29:15,173
Great things. We were like seven of 10 pages on the front page of cryptocurrency
subreddit yesterday or the day before.

518
00:29:15,213 --> 00:29:15,893
It's pretty funny.

519
00:29:16,813 --> 00:29:22,133
Yeah, everyone talks about me and not the software, which is funny because the
software is the only thing that matters.

520
00:29:22,813 --> 00:29:26,333
Of course. No, as I said, it's gotten very self-referential and gossipy.

521
00:29:26,333 --> 00:29:27,653
That's unfortunate.

522
00:29:28,093 --> 00:29:30,053
So what I invented.

523
00:29:30,093 --> 00:29:34,293
Well, there's a lot to say about you, Richard, as we know, as I've also heard.

524
00:29:34,333 --> 00:29:36,213
But, you know, you don't have any of that story.

525
00:29:36,973 --> 00:29:41,053
Well, I like me and I could talk about me all day, but everyone that's watching has
heard me do that.

526
00:29:41,613 --> 00:29:44,773
So I'll give you the I'll give you the short version of what hex is.

527
00:29:46,173 --> 00:29:48,773
Hex is the world's first blockchain time deposit.

528
00:29:49,973 --> 00:29:56,173
CD certificate for deposit bond GSC, I think they call it in Canada.

529
00:29:56,213 --> 00:29:59,453
It's got a different name or GIC in Canada.

530
00:30:00,453 --> 00:30:02,133
It's got a different name in every country for some reason.

531
00:30:02,133 --> 00:30:06,373
But basically, you're just saying if you lock your money for longer, you get more
interest.

532
00:30:07,013 --> 00:30:08,933
We're the first cryptocurrency in the world to do that.

533
00:30:09,573 --> 00:30:12,173
I don't know why. It's the second most popular product of the bank.

534
00:30:12,693 --> 00:30:16,693
It seems like an absolute no brainer that if you want to get rid of banks, you got
to get rid of all their products.

535
00:30:17,213 --> 00:30:19,373
The second most popular product there is the time deposit.

536
00:30:19,893 --> 00:30:20,893
And so we built that.

537
00:30:22,373 --> 00:30:23,573
Now, what does Bitcoin do?

538
00:30:24,213 --> 00:30:26,893
Bitcoin only rewards one behavior.

539
00:30:27,653 --> 00:30:29,093
It does not reward developers.

540
00:30:29,173 --> 00:30:30,813
Developers do not get free Bitcoin.

541
00:30:31,373 --> 00:30:32,653
It does not reward marketers.

542
00:30:32,653 --> 00:30:34,213
Marketers do not get free Bitcoin.

543
00:30:35,133 --> 00:30:36,413
It does not reward auditors.

544
00:30:37,133 --> 00:30:42,253
The only people that are rewarded in Bitcoin with Bitcoin are people that burn
electricity.

545
00:30:43,693 --> 00:30:47,773
Pay electric companies to do so and pollute the environment as the security model.

546
00:30:48,533 --> 00:30:50,893
Those are the only people that are rewarded in Bitcoin.

547
00:30:51,853 --> 00:30:56,973
Well, that sucks. There's a better way to incentivize people to have honest and good
action.

548
00:30:57,533 --> 00:31:03,053
If you control the money supply, you can say if you perform this good action, you
get some inflation.

549
00:31:03,373 --> 00:31:05,693
If you perform this good action, you get some inflation.

550
00:31:06,533 --> 00:31:08,653
And so in Bitcoin, there's only two pumpamentals.

551
00:31:09,053 --> 00:31:15,133
You could double click an exe and get some free coins, which weren't worth barely
anything when they when they when you got them.

552
00:31:16,173 --> 00:31:21,533
Like when I was mining full 50 block rewards solo with no pool, it was only worth
twenty five dollars.

553
00:31:22,133 --> 00:31:27,453
Wasn't worth much. And then, you know, the price went up and then you weren't able
to do that anymore.

554
00:31:27,493 --> 00:31:30,133
Double click an exe to get some free coins to stop working.

555
00:31:30,933 --> 00:31:36,933
So freemium went away and the one pumpamental that did stay is that the inflation
rate would drop in half every four years.

556
00:31:37,853 --> 00:31:51,373
And so actually, in the past, Bitcoin was very inflationary, which is the only way
that you can go from zero coins to 18 million coins is by inflating a lot because
they went from nothing to 18 million in 10 years.

557
00:31:53,053 --> 00:31:54,933
So what did I do?

558
00:31:56,093 --> 00:31:57,413
I said, all right, what do we want?

559
00:31:57,693 --> 00:32:04,813
We want to have a referral program to pay people inflation for when they were for
other people because it's successful in every industry that uses it.

560
00:32:05,133 --> 00:32:06,733
Excellent. What else do we want to do?

561
00:32:06,853 --> 00:32:09,053
We want to stop overpaying miners for security theater.

562
00:32:09,773 --> 00:32:15,493
In the old days, you used to pay miners to protect you from other people attacking
you because there was other people that could attack you.

563
00:32:15,973 --> 00:32:20,453
Now, there's not the people that you're protecting yourself from are the same people
you're paying.

564
00:32:21,053 --> 00:32:23,613
There's no other parties with shot to five, six mining hardware.

565
00:32:23,613 --> 00:32:25,893
They're going to attack you that aren't already mining.

566
00:32:26,133 --> 00:32:27,293
So it's a protection racket.

567
00:32:27,813 --> 00:32:29,613
They dump the price a million dollars an hour.

568
00:32:30,453 --> 00:32:33,853
All time high hash rate price is three times lower than all time high.

569
00:32:34,493 --> 00:32:40,493
Maximum cell pressure from the miners sucks, shoves the coin price down and they
don't talk to you on Twitter.

570
00:32:40,813 --> 00:32:42,013
They don't care what you have to say.

571
00:32:42,533 --> 00:32:48,013
They tried to make their own, you know, fork a Bitcoin to kill the original one,
which wasn't very nice.

572
00:32:49,573 --> 00:32:52,933
So I don't I would like to see miners stop being overpaid and dumping the price.

573
00:32:53,373 --> 00:32:55,293
And I would like to see people paid to refer people.

574
00:32:55,693 --> 00:32:58,333
And I would like to see inflation only paid to stakers.

575
00:32:58,333 --> 00:33:00,093
And the longer you lock, the more you're rewarded.

576
00:33:00,733 --> 00:33:05,053
And then we're paying stakers to hold the price up and staying instead of paying
miners to dump the price.

577
00:33:05,853 --> 00:33:08,013
This is all awesome, innovative stuff.

578
00:33:09,773 --> 00:33:11,013
So what do we do?

579
00:33:11,453 --> 00:33:14,173
We take the Bitcoin UTXO set, we pull out Mt.

580
00:33:14,173 --> 00:33:21,733
Gox so that they can't just dump coins for free, like what they did with Bitcoin
cash, selling 60,000 or 40,000 Bitcoin cash in the market.

581
00:33:22,493 --> 00:33:25,773
To enrich Mark Karpolos, well, that's a stupid idea.

582
00:33:25,773 --> 00:33:28,293
Bitcoin cash, guys, you should have been smart like me and fix that.

583
00:33:28,613 --> 00:33:31,333
So I fixed it because I did better than they did.

584
00:33:32,213 --> 00:33:33,173
So I removed Mt.

585
00:33:33,173 --> 00:33:37,653
Gox from the UTXO set, made a Merkle top hash or Merkle root, call it what you will.

586
00:33:37,693 --> 00:33:38,253
Same thing.

587
00:33:39,173 --> 00:33:48,093
And now you can free claim hex with your Bitcoin signature if you held Bitcoin at
December 1st, 7 p.m.

588
00:33:48,093 --> 00:33:48,533
EST.

589
00:33:49,533 --> 00:33:59,893
Now, multi-sig can't claim, penalizes whales, many, many exchanges use multi-sig and
whales themselves are penalized 50 to 75 percent.

590
00:34:00,293 --> 00:34:02,533
So it activates at a thousand Bitcoin.

591
00:34:03,693 --> 00:34:10,893
You get cut by 50 percent and then it scales up to 75 percent cut at 10,000 coins
and then it stays there.

592
00:34:11,613 --> 00:34:17,733
It's worth noting that 42 percent of all Bitcoin is held in addresses that hold over
a thousand BTC.

593
00:34:18,733 --> 00:34:26,573
And there's only 2000 such addresses, which means that 42 percent of Bitcoin is
controlled by 2000 addresses.

594
00:34:27,013 --> 00:34:28,813
And most people have more than one address.

595
00:34:29,333 --> 00:34:31,773
So it's very likely to be less than 2000 entities.

596
00:34:32,333 --> 00:34:38,613
So it's an extremely concentrated centralized system, which would be fine if you
were one of those centralized parties, then you would feel good.

597
00:34:38,933 --> 00:34:41,293
You know, people that aren't whales wish the whales would go away.

598
00:34:41,613 --> 00:34:43,453
People that are whales love being a whale.

599
00:34:43,693 --> 00:34:46,453
So hex doesn't hex doesn't get rid of the concept of whales.

600
00:34:46,453 --> 00:34:47,613
It just kills the old ones.

601
00:34:48,013 --> 00:34:50,533
And makes new ones of which you might be one.

602
00:34:51,533 --> 00:34:53,813
So what else do we have in there?

603
00:34:53,933 --> 00:34:54,893
So longer pays better.

604
00:34:54,893 --> 00:34:55,893
Bigger pays better.

605
00:34:56,253 --> 00:34:57,013
Free claim it.

606
00:34:57,093 --> 00:34:58,813
You can transform a theorem into hex.

607
00:34:59,373 --> 00:35:02,693
There's a bucket every day, one bucket full of hex, one empty bucket.

608
00:35:02,733 --> 00:35:04,133
People put ETH into that bucket.

609
00:35:04,493 --> 00:35:06,693
If you're 10 percent of the ETH bucket, you get 10 percent of the hex.

610
00:35:07,053 --> 00:35:08,413
End of the day, the bucket's empty.

611
00:35:08,773 --> 00:35:09,973
Next day, new buckets.

612
00:35:10,533 --> 00:35:15,853
And that happens for 351 days, which is basically what EOS did and raised $4.2
billion doing.

613
00:35:16,533 --> 00:35:19,533
So it's a very successful launch mechanism.

614
00:35:20,053 --> 00:35:25,533
We're very different from EOS in that they had nothing but promises and expectations
with no network.

615
00:35:25,773 --> 00:35:32,693
And we have no expectations and no promises and totally complete audited three times
network done.

616
00:35:33,453 --> 00:35:34,573
So it's the opposite.

617
00:35:35,413 --> 00:35:36,653
We're the opposite of an ICO.

618
00:35:37,493 --> 00:35:39,133
No promises and all product.

619
00:35:39,253 --> 00:35:40,733
And that's really good.

620
00:35:41,573 --> 00:35:41,973
Well, thank you.

621
00:35:41,973 --> 00:35:45,093
You know, you deserve, you deserve a lot of people should give you.

622
00:35:46,373 --> 00:36:00,093
Some respect for that, because the trend of just immediately raising with having
done no work, collecting all the money in advance and then usually not even shipping
anything is that was one of the most.

623
00:36:01,773 --> 00:36:09,013
Disheartening developments from the last five years that that was just so prominent
and ridiculous.

624
00:36:09,173 --> 00:36:09,533
I agree.

625
00:36:10,133 --> 00:36:10,773
I agree completely.

626
00:36:11,453 --> 00:36:12,613
You have a lot of bullet points there.

627
00:36:12,653 --> 00:36:13,173
That was crazy.

628
00:36:13,173 --> 00:36:14,933
So this is kind of like a custom hard fork.

629
00:36:14,973 --> 00:36:15,733
So it already happened.

630
00:36:15,733 --> 00:36:18,173
December 1st was the December 1st.

631
00:36:18,173 --> 00:36:19,453
7 p.m. was a snapshot.

632
00:36:19,613 --> 00:36:24,053
And then the contract launched on a theorem as an ERC 20 the next day.

633
00:36:25,133 --> 00:36:30,173
And then that was the day that the lobbies opened to start, like, turning a theorem
into hex.

634
00:36:30,293 --> 00:36:36,013
And then the next day, the free claiming opened because the, you know, the buckets
empty at the end of the day.

635
00:36:36,093 --> 00:36:39,653
And that would synchronize the free claimers and the transformers.

636
00:36:39,813 --> 00:36:41,653
The adoption amplifier guys would synchronize them.

637
00:36:41,933 --> 00:36:43,613
So you could both start their stakes at the same time.

638
00:36:44,613 --> 00:37:05,533
Now, to tell you how successful this project has been, over one billion dollars of
BTC has free claimed their hex, which is over 26000 Bitcoin addresses, over 146000
BTC and over 46000 stakes have been made and were the second most popular app on a
theorem, sometimes the first most popular.

639
00:37:05,893 --> 00:37:07,293
It's been that way since it's launched.

640
00:37:09,293 --> 00:37:10,253
So that's very exciting.

641
00:37:10,573 --> 00:37:15,133
So you didn't you did you have many again, you had many points.

642
00:37:15,213 --> 00:37:18,053
And it was difficult for me to understand, particularly that part about Mt.

643
00:37:18,053 --> 00:37:20,613
Gox. I don't think I understood at all what you're talking about.

644
00:37:21,053 --> 00:37:21,573
Oh, well, the Mt.

645
00:37:21,573 --> 00:37:27,893
Gox trustee in Japan is licensed by the court to manage the funds that used to be in
Mt.

646
00:37:27,893 --> 00:37:28,653
Gox, the Bitcoin.

647
00:37:29,493 --> 00:37:33,293
And he used to have 200,000 BTC or 193,000.

648
00:37:33,973 --> 00:37:39,093
And he sold to pay creditors 40,000 Bitcoin and 40,000 Bitcoin cash.

649
00:37:39,693 --> 00:37:42,653
How it seemed to make the reasonable decision at the time, didn't it?

650
00:37:43,373 --> 00:37:43,813
Say again.

651
00:37:44,373 --> 00:37:46,253
It seems like a reasonable decision at the time.

652
00:37:46,933 --> 00:37:53,413
Oh, well, I mean, sure, for him and for the creditors and for Mark Carpolis, it's
actually to get that money before anyone else does.

653
00:37:53,573 --> 00:37:56,253
And then they're going to have to resue him for it, I think, is how that's going to
work.

654
00:37:57,493 --> 00:37:58,693
Yeah, it's great for those guys.

655
00:37:58,773 --> 00:38:03,373
But is it good for the people that believed in Bitcoin cash to give this guy a bunch
of free money so he could dump it on their heads?

656
00:38:04,533 --> 00:38:05,333
It's a terrible idea.

657
00:38:05,493 --> 00:38:06,653
Didn't do anything good for the world.

658
00:38:07,333 --> 00:38:09,013
Giving the trustee of Mt.

659
00:38:09,013 --> 00:38:14,173
Gox free money to dump the Bitcoin cash price is a terrible, horrible, stupid idea.

660
00:38:14,773 --> 00:38:15,933
You need meritocracy.

661
00:38:16,093 --> 00:38:18,733
You should give money to people that have earned it and deserve it.

662
00:38:19,293 --> 00:38:22,173
So in hex, we don't pay miners inflation ever.

663
00:38:22,493 --> 00:38:23,373
Fuck those guys.

664
00:38:23,573 --> 00:38:26,093
They can earn a penny and that's what they get paid currently.

665
00:38:26,213 --> 00:38:27,413
A penny of Ethereum.

666
00:38:28,173 --> 00:38:30,773
I guess when the network's busy, it could be three cents or four cents.

667
00:38:31,773 --> 00:38:35,173
Fuck overpaying these guys inflation that they just sell on the market.

668
00:38:35,493 --> 00:38:36,573
They're not writing software.

669
00:38:36,773 --> 00:38:37,813
They're not improving anything.

670
00:38:37,973 --> 00:38:42,733
They're just destroying the planet with waste for a security theater.

671
00:38:43,213 --> 00:38:46,773
So your position is they add no value.

672
00:38:47,533 --> 00:38:47,973
Oh, no, sure.

673
00:38:47,973 --> 00:38:48,333
They do.

674
00:38:48,373 --> 00:38:49,533
They do add value.

675
00:38:50,093 --> 00:38:55,333
We still use proof of work, but someone else is already paying for it to happen.

676
00:38:55,493 --> 00:39:00,853
So you can derive more efficiency from the waste you already have by packing more
energy into it.

677
00:39:00,893 --> 00:39:06,613
You are just like free riding on blockchain and you don't need your own mining.

678
00:39:06,733 --> 00:39:07,373
Exactly.

679
00:39:07,613 --> 00:39:11,013
And it's more secure because if we had launched our own chain, we would have less

680
00:39:11,013 --> 00:39:12,773
hash rate and would be easily attacked.

681
00:39:13,013 --> 00:39:15,813
And if we had a proof of work change, we'd be even more easily attacked.

682
00:39:16,253 --> 00:39:19,933
So this was absolutely by far the best way to launch new game theory.

683
00:39:20,413 --> 00:39:20,613
Yes.

684
00:39:20,613 --> 00:39:29,133
No, I think that's part of the draw of Ethereum or really of why a lot of crazy

685
00:39:29,133 --> 00:39:31,933
ideas wanted to be tried.

686
00:39:32,453 --> 00:39:36,573
And they thought they I mean, they just naturally evolved into all being tried in

687
00:39:36,573 --> 00:39:38,213
one blockchain.

688
00:39:38,253 --> 00:39:39,533
See, there's so much better.

689
00:39:40,373 --> 00:39:42,613
I think there's I think there's a reason it's better that you might not know.

690
00:39:43,493 --> 00:39:43,893
Yes.

691
00:39:44,213 --> 00:39:45,253
OK, well, let's hear it.

692
00:39:46,133 --> 00:39:49,533
If you if you want, I never have used a stable coin in my life, really.

693
00:39:50,173 --> 00:39:53,893
Maybe on one small exchange for like maybe half a day or something.

694
00:39:54,853 --> 00:39:55,573
I don't like that.

695
00:39:55,893 --> 00:39:57,933
I believe crypto is made to get rid of counterparties.

696
00:39:58,253 --> 00:39:59,853
And a stable coin is the opposite.

697
00:39:59,893 --> 00:40:01,133
You're adding counterparties.

698
00:40:01,373 --> 00:40:02,013
So I don't like it.

699
00:40:02,493 --> 00:40:03,093
But you know what?

700
00:40:03,133 --> 00:40:04,933
The rest of the world loves it.

701
00:40:05,053 --> 00:40:06,013
Totally loves it.

702
00:40:06,253 --> 00:40:07,973
They absolutely love stable coins.

703
00:40:08,853 --> 00:40:13,853
And really, if you had Bitcoin at 20K and change them for stable coin, you did real

704
00:40:13,853 --> 00:40:17,733
good because now you can buy back for sixty eight hundred or seven thousand.

705
00:40:18,933 --> 00:40:21,813
So if you want to use a stable coin of Bitcoin, you know what you got to do?

706
00:40:22,093 --> 00:40:25,853
You got to leave the chain and you got to go through a central counterparty that

707
00:40:25,973 --> 00:40:29,653
could fuck you and not give you what you paid for to try and get into a stable coin.

708
00:40:29,973 --> 00:40:31,173
You got to go through an exchange.

709
00:40:31,693 --> 00:40:32,893
If there's an exchange, yes.

710
00:40:33,133 --> 00:40:36,213
But in a theorem, you don't have to because it's all in the same chain.

711
00:40:36,813 --> 00:40:38,573
They've got a stable coin on the chain.

712
00:40:39,213 --> 00:40:39,453
Right.

713
00:40:39,573 --> 00:40:42,053
If you want anonymity and Bitcoin, fuck yourself.

714
00:40:42,573 --> 00:40:43,853
You're going to have to go off chain.

715
00:40:44,293 --> 00:40:48,933
So you're going to have to go through an exchange to get to Monero or try and mix.

716
00:40:48,933 --> 00:40:50,693
And that mixing shit doesn't work very well at all.

717
00:40:52,413 --> 00:40:53,373
Or so.

718
00:40:53,453 --> 00:40:55,293
OK, so here we have Bitcoin.

719
00:40:55,933 --> 00:40:59,813
Certainly, I agree that it's better when it's all in the protocol.

720
00:41:00,493 --> 00:41:01,213
So good.

721
00:41:01,213 --> 00:41:04,173
You know, that's not actually a fundamental difference between Bitcoin and Ethereum

722
00:41:04,173 --> 00:41:05,493
because it is.

723
00:41:07,253 --> 00:41:09,893
You could we had counterparty and that could have had.

724
00:41:10,573 --> 00:41:14,053
No, but there's a big difference between a first tier citizen of a network and a

725
00:41:14,053 --> 00:41:14,973
second tier citizen.

726
00:41:14,973 --> 00:41:16,453
It was originally only on.

727
00:41:18,933 --> 00:41:21,493
It was only on Bitcoin, it was an Omni, so.

728
00:41:22,053 --> 00:41:25,133
Yeah, so Tether switched from using Omni on Bitcoin.

729
00:41:25,413 --> 00:41:30,813
To ERC 20, because it's better, they moved all their transactions over or 70

730
00:41:30,813 --> 00:41:32,893
percent of their transactions from Omni over to Ethereum.

731
00:41:33,493 --> 00:41:35,173
Well, they had support for both.

732
00:41:35,173 --> 00:41:39,293
And then they still have support for both, but they moved everything over because

733
00:41:39,293 --> 00:41:40,133
it's better on Ethereum.

734
00:41:40,893 --> 00:41:44,573
And by the way, that's that coin does more volume than any other cryptocurrency

735
00:41:44,573 --> 00:41:45,013
in the world.

736
00:41:45,453 --> 00:41:49,573
So for them to for the most commonly used cryptocurrency in the world, which is

737
00:41:49,573 --> 00:41:55,813
Tether, to switch its volume from Omni to ERC 20 is the strongest vote you could

738
00:41:55,813 --> 00:41:59,453
possibly have for which network's better because the people are using that's

739
00:41:59,453 --> 00:42:01,173
definitely not the case, I think.

740
00:42:01,173 --> 00:42:05,213
Well, I mean, I understand what you're trying to say, but you know that it's not

741
00:42:05,773 --> 00:42:11,093
simply I mean, this this is just a one dimensional thing about like which one

742
00:42:11,093 --> 00:42:13,693
more people are using today or recently.

743
00:42:13,693 --> 00:42:18,533
And, you know, as you know, the network can be networks can be designed in a way

744
00:42:18,573 --> 00:42:21,053
that the fees are lower and the user experience is better.

745
00:42:21,053 --> 00:42:28,893
But the overall long term effect is detrimental, which is exactly what Ethereum

746
00:42:28,893 --> 00:42:32,973
is doing. It's not so much killing the goose that lays the golden eggs, but slowly

747
00:42:33,653 --> 00:42:37,173
like you might want to check out what the theorem has been up to lately, man,
because

748
00:42:37,173 --> 00:42:38,533
it's not the same game anymore.

749
00:42:38,973 --> 00:42:39,853
It's totally different now.

750
00:42:40,613 --> 00:42:45,853
So they've got like thousand X on chain scaling through ZK roll ups and optimistic

751
00:42:45,853 --> 00:42:49,773
roll ups that are like forked in now that they can start.

752
00:42:49,773 --> 00:42:54,373
Well, there have been I think I agree with, you know, I always hated Ethereum and I

753
00:42:54,373 --> 00:42:55,293
still still hate it.

754
00:42:55,293 --> 00:43:00,733
But I want to retell this story of how Bitcoin was this amazing innovation.

755
00:43:00,733 --> 00:43:03,253
And then you had stuff like Litecoin, which is like a copy and paste.

756
00:43:03,253 --> 00:43:07,053
And then you had many ideas that were just the absolute worst idea ever.

757
00:43:07,533 --> 00:43:11,013
And they were those who these are the ideas that are being tried in 2014 or

758
00:43:11,733 --> 00:43:20,053
something. And and then you had Ethereum, which, you know, by all the signs was like

759
00:43:20,293 --> 00:43:21,853
the biggest scam ever.

760
00:43:21,853 --> 00:43:28,533
And indeed, from what I heard was just one or two chance coincidences away from

761
00:43:28,933 --> 00:43:30,373
collapsing completely.

762
00:43:30,453 --> 00:43:37,213
Sure. But I have to say that I think you're right to ask people to look at a second

763
00:43:37,213 --> 00:43:40,013
time because just different here.

764
00:43:42,133 --> 00:43:47,493
What I'm trying to say is that in the past, it was like every single red flag that
you

765
00:43:47,493 --> 00:43:51,373
could possibly raise was raised and it was like the worst project ever.

766
00:43:51,573 --> 00:43:54,093
But since then, many of those red flags have gone away.

767
00:43:54,093 --> 00:43:56,013
And so it still looks like a bad project.

768
00:43:56,013 --> 00:43:57,253
But I do think that people.

769
00:43:58,573 --> 00:44:03,333
Well, let me give you an example that it was like the absolute worst thing in the

770
00:44:03,333 --> 00:44:07,013
universe. Now, I think it could just merely be bad or something.

771
00:44:07,013 --> 00:44:08,973
But I think definitely people should look at it.

772
00:44:09,413 --> 00:44:11,453
Well, let me let me let me try and defend them.

773
00:44:11,453 --> 00:44:19,133
And so in in hex, the only thing it doesn't have one development is that they

774
00:44:19,133 --> 00:44:23,093
actually did ship something, which is that for a while they ship nothing.

775
00:44:23,093 --> 00:44:26,773
I mean, we do hear all this stuff about proof of stake is proof of stake has been

776
00:44:26,773 --> 00:44:29,653
three months away for like the last six years.

777
00:44:29,933 --> 00:44:31,893
Yeah, I know. That's how software is there.

778
00:44:32,493 --> 00:44:36,533
But you know, that's how every piece of software is, particularly blockchain

779
00:44:36,533 --> 00:44:39,213
software. Hex was late a year.

780
00:44:39,693 --> 00:44:41,493
Lightning has been late three years.

781
00:44:41,653 --> 00:44:43,413
Sidechain has been late five years.

782
00:44:43,813 --> 00:44:45,813
Sharding has been late four years.

783
00:44:45,973 --> 00:44:49,613
You know, like, you know, I agree that that is a property of software.

784
00:44:49,733 --> 00:44:53,053
Yeah. Particularly blockchain software where you can't just ship it.

785
00:44:53,053 --> 00:44:54,493
You have to get consensus as well.

786
00:44:54,573 --> 00:45:01,293
It's harder. So in hex, we want anonymous transactions and we want privacy because

787
00:45:01,573 --> 00:45:05,573
that fungibility is an important, an important, important, important part of

788
00:45:05,573 --> 00:45:09,453
being a human. You can't speak the truth unless you can speak the truth privately.

789
00:45:09,693 --> 00:45:12,773
If you have to tie your identity to everything, you can't speak the truth.

790
00:45:14,733 --> 00:45:19,933
You can't even. It's the United Nations, right, that you just can't over surveil

791
00:45:19,933 --> 00:45:20,933
people, fucks them up.

792
00:45:21,293 --> 00:45:25,333
So you just the people know that that is bad and people want their privacy and

793
00:45:25,333 --> 00:45:26,693
security. My favorite book.

794
00:45:26,693 --> 00:45:30,533
So say again, you know, the choir said 1984 is like my favorite book.

795
00:45:30,693 --> 00:45:31,533
There you go. Right.

796
00:45:32,493 --> 00:45:35,973
Yeah, we're getting an open door, as George Orwell used to say.

797
00:45:36,293 --> 00:45:43,493
Right. So if if you want anonymity in Bitcoin, you cannot get it on chain.

798
00:45:43,613 --> 00:45:45,533
It's not available. You have to go somewhere else.

799
00:45:46,213 --> 00:45:49,893
And the one thing that I regretted about building hex was that we didn't have

800
00:45:49,893 --> 00:45:51,653
anonymity. Well, guess what?

801
00:45:52,053 --> 00:45:54,773
Now we do. So there's a.

802
00:45:54,973 --> 00:46:00,893
There's a product called Tornado Cash, which is a contract that does zk-SNARKs

803
00:46:01,773 --> 00:46:06,493
on Ethereum and has an anonymity set and then, you know, groups, transactions by

804
00:46:06,493 --> 00:46:10,173
their size and their sets appear to be like about a thousand members right now.

805
00:46:11,213 --> 00:46:14,093
And, you know, it's open source and it's been audited.

806
00:46:15,133 --> 00:46:21,173
And there's somebody that I know that's, you know, making a fork to allow hex

807
00:46:21,813 --> 00:46:27,413
transactions to use that style of mixing so that anyone that wants to securely and

808
00:46:27,413 --> 00:46:31,213
anonymously transmit hex to other users can do so.

809
00:46:32,133 --> 00:46:36,373
I see. So it's like a it's like a Ethereum plug in or something.

810
00:46:36,373 --> 00:46:37,973
Right. Well, it's not a contract.

811
00:46:38,533 --> 00:46:41,653
So all these contracts can talk to each other on the same chain.

812
00:46:42,453 --> 00:46:47,093
And then there's no middlemen and it's beautiful and it's distributed finance.

813
00:46:47,173 --> 00:46:48,853
You want to get it? You want to use a stable coin?

814
00:46:48,853 --> 00:46:50,693
Bam, it's right there. You want to get it?

815
00:46:50,693 --> 00:46:55,013
It's right there. You want to you want to use this thing as collateral for this
other thing?

816
00:46:55,053 --> 00:46:58,853
Go ahead. You want to make a contract and encapsulates and wraps another contract
and do

817
00:46:58,853 --> 00:47:00,533
other types of logic? Go for it.

818
00:47:01,133 --> 00:47:02,573
It's truly programmable money.

819
00:47:03,333 --> 00:47:06,093
So when people bought Bitcoin, what they really thought they were buying was Monero

820
00:47:06,093 --> 00:47:08,053
because they thought it was anonymous, but it's not.

821
00:47:08,773 --> 00:47:12,093
And then when they heard about, you know, programmable money and all that shit when

822
00:47:12,093 --> 00:47:14,453
they bought their Bitcoin, that's actually Ethereum.

823
00:47:14,813 --> 00:47:16,333
Ethereum is actually programmable money.

824
00:47:16,373 --> 00:47:17,893
Monero is actually private money.

825
00:47:18,093 --> 00:47:21,573
And now with Tornado Cash, I believe Ethereum is also private money.

826
00:47:22,373 --> 00:47:27,333
You would have to, in theory, wait till the anonymity sets were as large as
Monero's, I

827
00:47:27,333 --> 00:47:31,133
think, depending on how strong the zk-SNARK stuff is.

828
00:47:31,613 --> 00:47:33,853
So it's like still awesome.

829
00:47:33,893 --> 00:47:37,693
Like we got anonymity for free because we chose the right platform.

830
00:47:38,813 --> 00:47:42,133
We're getting scaling increases for free because we chose the right platform.

831
00:47:42,173 --> 00:47:44,133
We have. Yeah, I understand.

832
00:47:44,133 --> 00:47:45,253
I was like, I didn't know what you meant there.

833
00:47:45,293 --> 00:47:50,533
Yes, you know, again, you're really good with all these bullet points.

834
00:47:50,573 --> 00:47:51,933
There's just so many sometimes.

835
00:47:52,093 --> 00:47:52,933
There's a shitload of them.

836
00:47:54,293 --> 00:47:59,373
You're saying that Ethereum is great because people will write weird little
contracts

837
00:47:59,373 --> 00:48:05,173
like ZK Tornado and ZK Rollups, which gives you benefits.

838
00:48:05,453 --> 00:48:07,933
Yep. And they'll keep writing them and they'll keep getting in.

839
00:48:08,973 --> 00:48:11,133
And that won't stop. It will just keep getting better.

840
00:48:11,453 --> 00:48:13,293
Have you heard of Uniswap?

841
00:48:14,173 --> 00:48:15,933
Oh, yes. No, I have not heard of it.

842
00:48:16,093 --> 00:48:19,573
Oh, it's awesome. It's an automated market maker.

843
00:48:20,533 --> 00:48:25,173
So it uses what's called X times Y equals K as a market maker.

844
00:48:25,213 --> 00:48:27,813
And so you just put in two different currencies, right?

845
00:48:27,813 --> 00:48:33,733
So you can put in like HEX and ETH and there is there is a Uniswap market for HEX.

846
00:48:34,413 --> 00:48:37,373
We're on 10 exchanges now because we chose the right ecosystem.

847
00:48:37,413 --> 00:48:41,013
People can turn us on an exchange with a click of a switch because it's near C20.

848
00:48:41,933 --> 00:48:43,933
So you put in ETH and you put in HEX.

849
00:48:44,373 --> 00:48:51,253
And then if people transform one thing into the other, it reduces one and makes the
other higher.

850
00:48:51,933 --> 00:48:55,973
And then it just automatically changes the price because it uses like their product
as the price.

851
00:48:56,693 --> 00:49:03,533
So it's just like you have an order, but you don't have an order book.

852
00:49:03,653 --> 00:49:08,773
It's an exchange that just always works and always shows you what your ratio is.

853
00:49:08,773 --> 00:49:12,413
And then there's no, there's no order matching.

854
00:49:12,413 --> 00:49:19,533
Yeah, I know exactly how automated market maker works, but I don't know if anyone in
your audience will.

855
00:49:21,173 --> 00:49:26,213
Well, they have that and it works amazing and it's free and it's audited and they
didn't even make any money on it.

856
00:49:26,373 --> 00:49:29,333
They literally just built it out of a grant from the Ethereum Foundation.

857
00:49:29,733 --> 00:49:37,813
He could have got so rich on that, but he was honest and did his work, you know, as
a college dude, as a college person.

858
00:49:38,613 --> 00:49:51,173
That was in school and just built this amazing thing that had he done an ICO for it,
probably would have got 30, 60 million or something, but instead, go ahead.

859
00:49:51,173 --> 00:49:51,893
That's a good point.

860
00:49:51,893 --> 00:49:59,973
It is weird, the temptation to do the ICO looms tremendously, but yeah, you know,
these.

861
00:50:00,122 --> 00:50:10,842
Well, it's true that younger people do like Ethereum, that's to me, that's sort of
one of the drawbacks that appeals to kind of naive and sort of maybe abstracts.

862
00:50:11,162 --> 00:50:15,402
But like, it's doing everything that Bitcoin wishes it could do.

863
00:50:15,642 --> 00:50:20,642
Is there an automated market making exchange that's trustless and peer to peer on
Bitcoin?

864
00:50:20,642 --> 00:50:21,642
No, but it's on Ethereum.

865
00:50:22,642 --> 00:50:29,562
You know, it's funny because again, the counterparty did have the DEX, which was
something like that, which is very funny.

866
00:50:29,562 --> 00:50:36,322
I mean, a lot of what we've been discussing has been retreading this point about
that there was.

867
00:50:37,162 --> 00:50:38,522
There was a dream and it failed.

868
00:50:38,522 --> 00:50:40,482
Counterparty and color coins on Bitcoin.

869
00:50:40,482 --> 00:50:42,722
There was a dream and it was tried and it failed.

870
00:50:43,562 --> 00:50:44,722
It fucking failed.

871
00:50:45,162 --> 00:50:46,522
Bitcoin was supposed to be a currency.

872
00:50:46,522 --> 00:50:47,202
It didn't work.

873
00:50:48,282 --> 00:50:49,522
Bitcoin was supposed to be a currency.

874
00:50:49,562 --> 00:50:50,242
It did not work.

875
00:50:50,282 --> 00:50:52,042
Less people accept it now than 2017.

876
00:50:53,162 --> 00:50:58,122
There's less on-chain volume, there's less new people getting on, there's less
Google searches, there's less Twitter searches.

877
00:50:58,602 --> 00:51:00,922
There's been no fucking upgrades to the feature set.

878
00:51:01,242 --> 00:51:08,802
2017, when there was this big bubble, that's not really, I think that would be
expected, even if it's.

879
00:51:08,842 --> 00:51:11,722
But it's still lower than like fucking 2016, too.

880
00:51:12,642 --> 00:51:14,682
It's shittier than before the bubble.

881
00:51:15,442 --> 00:51:16,682
It's really shit.

882
00:51:17,202 --> 00:51:27,042
Yeah, I'm not familiar with any of those numbers, but my understanding is that if
you compare things like media activity, Google searches and things for Ethereum and
Bitcoin.

883
00:51:27,242 --> 00:51:28,802
Oh no, Bitcoin's crushing Ethereum, sure.

884
00:51:28,802 --> 00:51:29,802
Yeah, and those things.

885
00:51:29,802 --> 00:51:30,122
Yes.

886
00:51:31,722 --> 00:51:39,242
I'm not saying Bitcoin, I'm not saying Ethereum got better fucking retail adoption
than Bitcoin did, because Bitcoin, as bad as it is, is still doing better than
Ethereum at retail adoption.

887
00:51:39,242 --> 00:51:39,562
Sure.

888
00:51:40,362 --> 00:51:41,002
Yeah, right.

889
00:51:41,202 --> 00:51:42,282
That's what I'm wondering about.

890
00:51:42,602 --> 00:51:55,962
Because I am solving all of these fucking things with Hex, so we have got, so people
talk about Hex being a scam, and it blows my goddamn mind, because it's the opposite
of a scam.

891
00:51:57,042 --> 00:51:58,722
There's scammers that used to promote.

892
00:51:58,802 --> 00:51:59,442
No, let's hear it.

893
00:51:59,442 --> 00:52:04,122
This is the big, this is what I'm interested in personally, because this is where
the drama is.

894
00:52:04,162 --> 00:52:05,082
I'm just like, oh.

895
00:52:05,362 --> 00:52:07,242
There's scammers that used to promote BitConnect.

896
00:52:07,282 --> 00:52:07,642
Yeah.

897
00:52:07,922 --> 00:52:08,242
Yeah.

898
00:52:08,842 --> 00:52:12,722
Trayvon James and Craig Grant used to promote BitConnect, now they promote Hex.

899
00:52:13,122 --> 00:52:13,602
Why?

900
00:52:14,202 --> 00:52:15,962
Because they see this shit will pop off.

901
00:52:16,202 --> 00:52:17,722
They see it's got virality to it.

902
00:52:17,722 --> 00:52:19,202
They see that it's got stickiness to it.

903
00:52:19,482 --> 00:52:20,802
It's addictive for them to use.

904
00:52:20,842 --> 00:52:22,082
They use it a lot.

905
00:52:22,322 --> 00:52:26,282
They get a lot of referrals, and they stake their coins, and they ladder their
stakes.

906
00:52:26,282 --> 00:52:30,882
You have some kind of referral thing, which is sort of shady, but maybe not totally
shady.

907
00:52:30,882 --> 00:52:32,082
How is referral shady?

908
00:52:32,602 --> 00:52:33,802
Amazon has referrals.

909
00:52:34,602 --> 00:52:41,842
Well, one thing is that it is a hazard to truth, because you don't know if people
are saying what they believe, or saying something just to...

910
00:52:42,322 --> 00:52:47,842
If you think anyone's being truthful when they show you your crypto bag, I have
fucking news for you.

911
00:52:48,042 --> 00:52:51,602
They don't even understand what they own to even tell you the truth if they wanted
to.

912
00:52:51,602 --> 00:53:01,882
I agree that merely owning any asset, including crypto, possibly especially crypto,
but everyone has a temptation to talk up their own book.

913
00:53:02,842 --> 00:53:12,282
I agree that it's not specific to having, but if you have a referral surplus, then I
guess it would apply double, would it not?

914
00:53:13,642 --> 00:53:19,202
If you don't think someone should be incentivized to share something good with you
that you benefited from, you're a prick.

915
00:53:19,962 --> 00:53:27,682
People should be rewarded for doing good, honest things, and sharing something that
is good that benefits your life with you is something someone should be rewarded
for.

916
00:53:29,122 --> 00:53:30,322
Yeah, it's not inherently bad.

917
00:53:30,362 --> 00:53:31,282
I just say it's a hazard.

918
00:53:31,762 --> 00:53:32,522
Sure. Okay.

919
00:53:32,562 --> 00:53:33,162
Yeah, sure.

920
00:53:33,362 --> 00:53:33,762
Agree.

921
00:53:34,322 --> 00:53:35,042
Anyway, you have...

922
00:53:35,082 --> 00:53:36,362
Yeah, a lot of people use it for evil.

923
00:53:37,802 --> 00:53:39,002
It's a force multiplier.

924
00:53:39,242 --> 00:53:40,922
You can use it for evil or you can use it for good.

925
00:53:41,042 --> 00:53:41,762
It's just like a gun.

926
00:53:42,082 --> 00:53:43,442
The referral program is like a gun.

927
00:53:43,682 --> 00:53:45,602
If you're a good guy, it's going to make you a better good guy.

928
00:53:45,762 --> 00:53:47,442
If you're a bad guy, it's gonna make you a better bad guy.

929
00:53:48,362 --> 00:53:49,242
So what matters is...

930
00:53:49,242 --> 00:53:52,762
I get that, but anyway, please describe it anyway.

931
00:53:52,762 --> 00:53:52,922
Sure.

932
00:53:53,722 --> 00:54:09,082
Well, if someone clicks your link to go to the site and they transform Ethereum into
Hex or free claim their Bitcoin, they get 10% more by using your link, and you get
20% on top of what they got, and the currency inflates 32% to pay you guys.

933
00:54:09,402 --> 00:54:09,842
That's it.

934
00:54:10,562 --> 00:54:11,522
Oh, that's very neat.

935
00:54:11,762 --> 00:54:12,002
Yeah.

936
00:54:12,602 --> 00:54:13,562
And there's no sign up.

937
00:54:13,562 --> 00:54:14,602
There's no statefulness.

938
00:54:14,762 --> 00:54:16,602
It just logs a cookie inside the browser.

939
00:54:17,202 --> 00:54:24,682
So you literally are just going to hex.win forward slash question mark R equals your
Ethereum address, and that's your referral link.

940
00:54:25,282 --> 00:54:37,202
And now you can send that to anyone you want in the world, and you'll be
incentivized for them turning Ethereum into Hex or free claiming their free Bitcoin
to Hex.

941
00:54:38,842 --> 00:54:43,282
Well, I don't completely understand how it all works, but don't people just refer
themselves so that they make sure...

942
00:54:43,722 --> 00:54:46,562
They can try to, but there's some logic in there that prevents it.

943
00:54:47,002 --> 00:54:47,882
So they can do it.

944
00:54:48,002 --> 00:54:55,362
It is possible to do it, but we make it a challenge to do it because we want honest
referrers to be rewarded for the honest work that they've done.

945
00:54:57,802 --> 00:54:58,802
So yes, you have.

946
00:54:58,962 --> 00:55:07,402
The other thing I was interested in is you have some kind of like the kind of stick
or the story, the culture, the all important culture that I was talking about.

947
00:55:07,402 --> 00:55:09,482
You have some kind of premium on hodling.

948
00:55:11,362 --> 00:55:11,722
Well, yeah.

949
00:55:11,722 --> 00:55:13,402
I mean, that's the only thing that makes the price go up.

950
00:55:13,922 --> 00:55:14,122
Yes.

951
00:55:14,122 --> 00:55:19,482
We didn't actually get to talk about your earliest point about the CD, about how it
works, blocking marks.

952
00:55:19,802 --> 00:55:22,442
This is turning into a great commercial, but I mean, I'm loving it personally.

953
00:55:23,602 --> 00:55:27,362
Look, it's like, this is actual innovative stuff.

954
00:55:27,522 --> 00:55:30,402
This is not like, hey, we changed the proof of work bullshit.

955
00:55:30,602 --> 00:55:31,682
We changed everything.

956
00:55:31,962 --> 00:55:32,962
We changed the economics.

957
00:55:32,962 --> 00:55:34,082
We changed the game theory.

958
00:55:34,362 --> 00:55:35,522
We're punishing the whales.

959
00:55:35,562 --> 00:55:36,882
We're doing social engineering.

960
00:55:37,882 --> 00:55:38,962
Yeah, I think that's very funny.

961
00:55:38,962 --> 00:55:46,922
You have a very like a custom bespoke hard fork, trimming some of the balances, sort
of.

962
00:55:46,922 --> 00:55:47,562
It's very funny.

963
00:55:47,562 --> 00:55:49,082
I think it's neat.

964
00:55:49,082 --> 00:55:52,282
It's definitely going to be, I hope, someone somewhere right.

965
00:55:53,602 --> 00:55:54,722
It'll be an interesting story.

966
00:55:55,402 --> 00:55:57,442
You want some other killer things that you haven't heard about yet?

967
00:55:57,602 --> 00:55:58,322
Auto staking.

968
00:55:58,602 --> 00:56:02,722
If you free claim, you're locked for 350 day minimum, 90%.

969
00:56:03,882 --> 00:56:05,362
So you got to hold that bag and watch it.

970
00:56:06,322 --> 00:56:07,082
To care about it.

971
00:56:07,082 --> 00:56:08,282
See, the people cannot sell.

972
00:56:08,282 --> 00:56:12,282
This is kind of like the vault in OneCoin.

973
00:56:13,362 --> 00:56:15,922
I don't actually know about OneCoin or Bitconnect very much.

974
00:56:15,922 --> 00:56:19,442
I should have researched them, truthfully, because they were quite successful.

975
00:56:19,442 --> 00:56:25,762
Of course, all these things, you see these problems, they want, these dishonest
projects

976
00:56:26,002 --> 00:56:33,682
want a way to trap innocent people, prevent them from ever redeeming.

977
00:56:34,402 --> 00:56:39,522
Purely redeem or whatever, wants everyone to never be able to redeem so that the
people at the top can

978
00:56:39,522 --> 00:56:44,562
redeem at the opportune moment, in the false loop, take all the money off the table.

979
00:56:45,602 --> 00:56:48,722
Of course, it's like all very suspicious and weird.

980
00:56:49,522 --> 00:56:50,722
Honest projects do that too.

981
00:56:51,282 --> 00:56:53,482
That's what a vesting period is when you start a startup.

982
00:56:54,002 --> 00:56:55,682
Yeah, you are right about that.

983
00:56:55,762 --> 00:56:56,002
Yeah.

984
00:56:56,882 --> 00:56:58,402
So we want people that skin in the game.

985
00:56:58,402 --> 00:57:03,482
But it's a little bit more, usually when a startup, there's a little bit more logic
to it.

986
00:57:04,482 --> 00:57:08,002
People who have the most inside information usually are locked the longest.

987
00:57:08,402 --> 00:57:11,122
With this, I don't know if that's the case, seems to reverse maybe.

988
00:57:11,122 --> 00:57:12,722
But again, I don't really know anything about it.

989
00:57:13,202 --> 00:57:13,442
Sure.

990
00:57:14,002 --> 00:57:19,842
So the other thing is, how many people were served well by dumping their Bitcoin
bags

991
00:57:19,842 --> 00:57:22,242
any time between now and 10 years ago?

992
00:57:23,442 --> 00:57:27,202
Almost everyone would have been done way better if they couldn't touch their back.

993
00:57:28,482 --> 00:57:31,922
So if you have an honest project with a product market fit and adoption,

994
00:57:32,082 --> 00:57:35,682
it seems like keeping your hands off it could be a really fabulous thing.

995
00:57:35,682 --> 00:57:36,962
Yeah, you have a suicide pact.

996
00:57:36,962 --> 00:57:39,362
You and everyone else are all in it together.

997
00:57:39,362 --> 00:57:40,562
You're all in it for the long haul.

998
00:57:40,562 --> 00:57:41,282
You're not going to sell.

999
00:57:42,002 --> 00:57:46,162
Well, we're the first cryptocurrency in the world with a chart of future market
supply,

1000
00:57:46,162 --> 00:57:49,522
not total supply, but total supply and market supply.

1001
00:57:49,522 --> 00:57:54,002
So you can see, you can go to hexstat.com, singular, hexstat.com.

1002
00:57:54,002 --> 00:57:56,482
You can see a chart of when everyone's stakes are ending.

1003
00:57:57,042 --> 00:58:00,162
And about 85% of the currency is staked.

1004
00:58:00,802 --> 00:58:02,082
Oh, that's pretty interesting.

1005
00:58:02,082 --> 00:58:03,042
I've got to hand it to you.

1006
00:58:03,042 --> 00:58:08,002
That's kind of neat, especially as someone who knows about different monetary
aggregates,

1007
00:58:08,002 --> 00:58:15,522
as they're called, M1, M2, just like money is sometimes described as an adjective
and not as a...

1008
00:58:15,522 --> 00:58:18,562
Well, money is primarily credit, but people don't realize it.

1009
00:58:19,122 --> 00:58:22,082
It's like nine-tenths credit and one-tenth actual money.

1010
00:58:24,082 --> 00:58:25,842
Well, money takes many, many forms.

1011
00:58:26,802 --> 00:58:31,362
Well, money takes many, many forms, which is interesting.

1012
00:58:31,362 --> 00:58:34,802
So you have struck on that note.

1013
00:58:35,922 --> 00:58:37,202
Well, I mean, we should have...

1014
00:58:37,202 --> 00:58:43,282
You understand why people be suspicious of it, though, for the reasons...

1015
00:58:43,282 --> 00:58:45,922
The reason everyone's suspicious is because of the marketing.

1016
00:58:45,922 --> 00:58:47,362
I'm good at marketing.

1017
00:58:47,362 --> 00:58:51,762
And so I looked at why people buy Bitcoin and why people buy Ethereum,

1018
00:58:51,762 --> 00:58:54,322
the real reason why, because they want to make money.

1019
00:58:54,322 --> 00:58:56,162
And so I speak to that real reason.

1020
00:58:56,162 --> 00:59:02,642
And I say, this cryptocurrency, Hex, is designed to go up 10,000x in two and a half
years.

1021
00:59:03,282 --> 00:59:04,242
Might not do it.

1022
00:59:04,242 --> 00:59:05,522
Might go to zero.

1023
00:59:05,522 --> 00:59:09,922
But its design intention is to go up in price through having these unique features.

1024
00:59:11,362 --> 00:59:15,202
Time locking, world's first blockchain city, world's first chart of future market
supply,

1025
00:59:15,762 --> 00:59:20,882
referral system, penalize the whales, freemium onboarding,

1026
00:59:20,882 --> 00:59:23,362
auto staking that locks them up for at least a year.

1027
00:59:23,362 --> 00:59:25,202
They can choose to stake longer, the longer you stake,

1028
00:59:25,202 --> 00:59:29,922
you can make up to three times the shares at a 3641 day stake, which is about 10
years.

1029
00:59:32,802 --> 00:59:34,322
So do I know what will happen?

1030
00:59:34,322 --> 00:59:35,282
I have no idea.

1031
00:59:35,282 --> 00:59:36,242
Price could go to zero.

1032
00:59:37,202 --> 00:59:39,122
But I also know what's possible.

1033
00:59:39,122 --> 00:59:42,402
And what's possible is that this does something better than Bitcoin or Ethereum did.

1034
00:59:43,122 --> 00:59:46,482
And when I quote 10,000x, people think that I'm like retarded,

1035
00:59:46,482 --> 00:59:47,762
like that number is not reasonable.

1036
00:59:48,322 --> 00:59:53,602
But they don't realize that Bitcoin's up 700,000x and was up 2,000,000x in 2017.

1037
00:59:54,322 --> 00:59:57,282
And more actually, but I'm just choosing a penny as a starting point.

1038
00:59:58,322 --> 01:00:00,562
So I'm not choosing an outrageous number.

1039
01:00:00,562 --> 01:00:02,082
I'm choosing a very reasonable number.

1040
01:00:02,082 --> 01:00:05,362
I'm saying it's a possibility and that I have no idea what it'll do.

1041
01:00:05,362 --> 01:00:07,922
But they see that language and their little pea brains are like,

1042
01:00:07,922 --> 01:00:10,162
scam, scam, scam, it's got to be a scam.

1043
01:00:10,162 --> 01:00:14,002
Well, dude, Bitcoin's already up 75 times higher than what I'm talking about.

1044
01:00:14,322 --> 01:00:17,442
So yeah, you are good at marketing.

1045
01:00:17,442 --> 01:00:18,882
That's psychology.

1046
01:00:18,882 --> 01:00:19,842
That's called an anchor.

1047
01:00:21,762 --> 01:00:22,322
Yeah, I don't know.

1048
01:00:23,042 --> 01:00:23,762
It's a pretty neat.

1049
01:00:24,962 --> 01:00:28,322
You know, it's funny is that obviously, it sounds like a crazy project.

1050
01:00:28,322 --> 01:00:30,562
And personally, I remain extremely...

1051
01:00:30,562 --> 01:00:32,082
Why don't you claim your free hacks, man?

1052
01:00:32,082 --> 01:00:33,122
You've had some Bitcoin, right?

1053
01:00:33,842 --> 01:00:34,322
It is funny.

1054
01:00:35,362 --> 01:00:39,762
You've engineered it to evade many criticisms in a clever way,

1055
01:00:39,762 --> 01:00:41,602
because she's giving away free money.

1056
01:00:41,602 --> 01:00:43,362
And you're right that it really isn't.

1057
01:00:43,922 --> 01:00:47,282
I'm thinking about like, you know, the certificate of deposit at a bank.

1058
01:00:47,282 --> 01:00:51,282
And I'm also thinking about the way that FDIC insurance works

1059
01:00:51,282 --> 01:00:52,722
at a commercial bank in the United States.

1060
01:00:52,722 --> 01:00:54,082
And you're like, it's kind of funny like that.

1061
01:00:54,082 --> 01:00:58,642
It's really the tier one capital requirements and all these things.

1062
01:00:59,442 --> 01:01:02,002
There's Basel treaties and whatnot.

1063
01:01:02,002 --> 01:01:03,922
And it's funny that it isn't quite...

1064
01:01:03,922 --> 01:01:06,882
I don't know what if it says more about Hex or about traditional banking,

1065
01:01:06,882 --> 01:01:12,402
but it's less different than you might think, which I find to be amusing.

1066
01:01:12,402 --> 01:01:15,122
Well, see, this is why I love talking to you.

1067
01:01:16,162 --> 01:01:19,922
When I talk to people that are smart, there's no disagreements.

1068
01:01:19,922 --> 01:01:21,602
Like every time I have a chat with someone,

1069
01:01:21,602 --> 01:01:23,282
everyone treats it like it's a debate,

1070
01:01:23,282 --> 01:01:25,682
because I spend so much time correcting people.

1071
01:01:25,682 --> 01:01:27,762
Okay, well, here's one.

1072
01:01:27,762 --> 01:01:29,602
Here's the big thing.

1073
01:01:29,602 --> 01:01:30,562
You're selling this.

1074
01:01:30,562 --> 01:01:33,442
You have this idea of making a lot of money.

1075
01:01:33,442 --> 01:01:41,122
That is a kind of wishful thinking dream that, again, major hazard to truth.

1076
01:01:41,122 --> 01:01:45,602
Wishful thinking is very effective at deceiving people.

1077
01:01:46,882 --> 01:01:49,282
It's also very effective at building amazing things.

1078
01:01:49,282 --> 01:01:56,962
You're selling a really big dream that some people will want to believe,

1079
01:01:56,962 --> 01:01:58,562
and then their brain will shut off.

1080
01:02:00,402 --> 01:02:00,882
Yeah, sure.

1081
01:02:01,522 --> 01:02:02,402
Yeah, but you know what?

1082
01:02:02,402 --> 01:02:04,882
They're going to do that same shit for something worse, mate.

1083
01:02:04,882 --> 01:02:06,482
So if you care about...

1084
01:02:06,482 --> 01:02:07,842
Let's talk about killing scams.

1085
01:02:07,842 --> 01:02:09,282
Let's talk about killing them.

1086
01:02:09,282 --> 01:02:10,802
You have three options to kill scams.

1087
01:02:11,202 --> 01:02:12,242
Regulatory.

1088
01:02:12,242 --> 01:02:13,602
They don't have enough money.

1089
01:02:13,602 --> 01:02:15,282
They don't have enough enforcement.

1090
01:02:15,282 --> 01:02:18,082
They only come after the fact, after all the money's already been stolen.

1091
01:02:18,082 --> 01:02:20,242
They barely ever get any of it back.

1092
01:02:20,242 --> 01:02:22,402
And even if you could solve all those problems,

1093
01:02:22,402 --> 01:02:24,642
you'd only solve them in countries with good governments.

1094
01:02:24,642 --> 01:02:27,122
And a lot of countries in the world have fucked up governments.

1095
01:02:27,122 --> 01:02:32,242
So even those countries wouldn't be able to benefit from your regulatory innovation.

1096
01:02:33,042 --> 01:02:35,762
You could beg the people to stop getting scammed and be smarter,

1097
01:02:35,762 --> 01:02:38,882
but you don't have a marketing budget to reach the people.

1098
01:02:38,962 --> 01:02:41,202
And when you try and tell them not to get scammed,

1099
01:02:41,202 --> 01:02:44,162
they don't believe you because the scammers have a better story than you

1100
01:02:44,162 --> 01:02:45,842
and a better marketing budget.

1101
01:02:45,842 --> 01:02:48,322
So if anyone did even hear you warning them,

1102
01:02:48,322 --> 01:02:49,762
they wouldn't take your advice.

1103
01:02:49,762 --> 01:02:50,802
Because I tried.

1104
01:02:50,802 --> 01:02:51,842
Other people tried.

1105
01:02:51,842 --> 01:02:53,202
They fell for all that shit anyway.

1106
01:02:53,922 --> 01:02:54,242
Right?

1107
01:02:54,242 --> 01:02:56,482
2017, I was screaming real loud,

1108
01:02:56,482 --> 01:02:58,562
and everyone got rich, and then everyone got poor.

1109
01:02:59,762 --> 01:03:00,082
Yes.

1110
01:03:00,722 --> 01:03:01,442
So it doesn't work.

1111
01:03:02,002 --> 01:03:02,962
So you know what could work?

1112
01:03:02,962 --> 01:03:05,362
The question is for the suppression strategies,

1113
01:03:06,402 --> 01:03:08,242
as you say, in this world.

1114
01:03:08,242 --> 01:03:09,282
The DeFi world.

1115
01:03:10,482 --> 01:03:13,922
The world on the internet,

1116
01:03:13,922 --> 01:03:16,722
where people could be in different countries and have no identity.

1117
01:03:17,922 --> 01:03:20,402
I agree that that's unlikely to work.

1118
01:03:20,402 --> 01:03:21,282
I don't even think, you know,

1119
01:03:21,282 --> 01:03:23,202
I mean, even in the United States,

1120
01:03:23,202 --> 01:03:24,242
a lot of these projects,

1121
01:03:25,042 --> 01:03:26,882
they do the ICO and they raise a ton of money,

1122
01:03:26,882 --> 01:03:30,002
and then they buy the lawyers or,

1123
01:03:31,522 --> 01:03:34,722
you know, I suspect the regulators as well.

1124
01:03:34,722 --> 01:03:36,002
I know what you're talking about.

1125
01:03:36,962 --> 01:03:38,242
It's called regulatory capture.

1126
01:03:38,802 --> 01:03:40,722
You can read about it on deepcapture.org.

1127
01:03:41,282 --> 01:03:46,722
So if you want to actually stop scams from scamming so much,

1128
01:03:47,282 --> 01:03:49,362
I'm the guy that actually came up with a solution.

1129
01:03:49,362 --> 01:03:50,882
I'm the only guy talking about it,

1130
01:03:50,882 --> 01:03:52,562
because I guess I invented it.

1131
01:03:52,562 --> 01:03:54,882
You starve them out like you starve a bacteria.

1132
01:03:55,522 --> 01:03:56,722
Starve them out.

1133
01:03:56,722 --> 01:03:58,482
Yeah, there's a bacteria.

1134
01:03:58,482 --> 01:04:01,282
That was originally the sidechain pitch as well.

1135
01:04:01,282 --> 01:04:01,602
Great.

1136
01:04:01,602 --> 01:04:02,162
There you go.

1137
01:04:02,162 --> 01:04:03,202
There'll be no story.

1138
01:04:03,202 --> 01:04:07,202
There'll be no good story that an altcoiner can tell,

1139
01:04:07,202 --> 01:04:08,962
because even hypothetically,

1140
01:04:08,962 --> 01:04:10,082
if they did invent something,

1141
01:04:10,082 --> 01:04:11,922
it would be copied to a sidechain of Bitcoin.

1142
01:04:11,922 --> 01:04:13,122
And then there you go.

1143
01:04:13,122 --> 01:04:14,482
You know, no basis.

1144
01:04:14,482 --> 01:04:15,442
Similar story.

1145
01:04:15,442 --> 01:04:16,722
I agree with that strategy,

1146
01:04:16,722 --> 01:04:18,002
but I don't know if, you know,

1147
01:04:18,882 --> 01:04:22,642
I've already taken away the instantiation of that strategy.

1148
01:04:22,642 --> 01:04:22,962
I don't know.

1149
01:04:22,962 --> 01:04:24,962
Maybe I've already in the real world,

1150
01:04:24,962 --> 01:04:26,162
seen it working,

1151
01:04:26,162 --> 01:04:28,002
taking people that used to promote scams,

1152
01:04:28,002 --> 01:04:29,202
and now they promote something good.

1153
01:04:30,242 --> 01:04:31,282
It's really that easy.

1154
01:04:31,282 --> 01:04:32,482
This is not a question.

1155
01:04:32,482 --> 01:04:33,682
This is fact.

1156
01:04:33,682 --> 01:04:35,522
Instead of whatever.

1157
01:04:35,522 --> 01:04:37,042
They're not promoting BitConnect

1158
01:04:37,042 --> 01:04:38,882
or some other bullshit Ponzi scam.

1159
01:04:38,882 --> 01:04:40,082
They're promoting Hex,

1160
01:04:40,082 --> 01:04:41,922
which means that the bullshit Ponzi scams

1161
01:04:41,922 --> 01:04:42,642
they could be promoting,

1162
01:04:42,642 --> 01:04:44,002
like CloudToken in Asia,

1163
01:04:44,562 --> 01:04:45,842
they're not fucking promoting them

1164
01:04:45,842 --> 01:04:47,282
because they're promoting Hex.

1165
01:04:47,282 --> 01:04:50,322
So Hex is out competing for resources and mindshare,

1166
01:04:51,042 --> 01:04:54,082
the food source that the fucking scammers are operating on.

1167
01:04:54,962 --> 01:04:55,682
I understand.

1168
01:04:55,682 --> 01:04:56,402
It's beautiful and it can scale.

1169
01:04:56,402 --> 01:04:57,042
It's very interesting.

1170
01:04:57,042 --> 01:04:58,882
You're saying it's more efficient for everyone

1171
01:04:58,882 --> 01:05:04,162
to pile on on shilling for this one thing

1172
01:05:04,162 --> 01:05:10,162
with referrals and with bonuses for hodling and things.

1173
01:05:10,162 --> 01:05:12,242
But, you know, it actually, unfortunately,

1174
01:05:12,242 --> 01:05:14,402
I mean, even though it is very clever,

1175
01:05:14,402 --> 01:05:15,842
it is circular reasoning.

1176
01:05:15,842 --> 01:05:16,322
Is it not?

1177
01:05:16,322 --> 01:05:20,242
It's just assuming that this project will work

1178
01:05:20,242 --> 01:05:22,482
and therefore it's better to show-

1179
01:05:22,482 --> 01:05:23,122
It's speculation.

1180
01:05:23,922 --> 01:05:24,802
Even if it does work,

1181
01:05:24,802 --> 01:05:27,762
it's still probably going to drop 85, 95% at some point

1182
01:05:27,762 --> 01:05:29,282
because that's just what crypto does.

1183
01:05:30,082 --> 01:05:31,202
But the question is,

1184
01:05:31,202 --> 01:05:32,242
will it come back again?

1185
01:05:33,362 --> 01:05:38,082
So the difference between Bitcoin and Dogecoin is not that much.

1186
01:05:38,082 --> 01:05:39,922
Bitcoin dropped 85%.

1187
01:05:39,922 --> 01:05:41,202
Dogecoin dropped 94%.

1188
01:05:42,162 --> 01:05:42,662
Wow.

1189
01:05:43,522 --> 01:05:44,322
Big difference.

1190
01:05:45,122 --> 01:05:45,922
Store value.

1191
01:05:45,922 --> 01:05:47,522
Tell me more about store value.

1192
01:05:47,522 --> 01:05:49,522
Shit drops 85% every three years.

1193
01:05:50,162 --> 01:05:51,202
Shit store value.

1194
01:05:51,202 --> 01:05:51,702
Garbage.

1195
01:05:52,482 --> 01:05:55,202
Not much better than anything else in crypto, really.

1196
01:05:55,202 --> 01:05:58,322
Do you really think that Bitcoin and Dogecoin are really not the difference?

1197
01:05:58,322 --> 01:05:59,442
All you gotta do is look at the chart.

1198
01:06:00,002 --> 01:06:01,282
You literally just have to look at the chart.

1199
01:06:02,002 --> 01:06:03,362
What's in people's minds

1200
01:06:03,362 --> 01:06:07,362
is much more important than any piece of software code.

1201
01:06:08,562 --> 01:06:12,002
But also, there's huge, massive network effects of Bitcoin.

1202
01:06:13,122 --> 01:06:16,882
Bro, if your shit drops 85% every three years,

1203
01:06:16,882 --> 01:06:18,562
you have to quit with the like,

1204
01:06:18,562 --> 01:06:21,362
we're better than everyone else from a price perspective thing.

1205
01:06:21,362 --> 01:06:21,922
Because you're not.

1206
01:06:22,882 --> 01:06:26,722
Oh, well, like BNB has outperformed Bitcoin by 450 fucking X.

1207
01:06:27,282 --> 01:06:30,082
Drops a large amount only after it has risen.

1208
01:06:30,082 --> 01:06:32,562
And even larger, larger amounts.

1209
01:06:32,562 --> 01:06:33,062
Yes.

1210
01:06:36,082 --> 01:06:37,282
If you went to sleep,

1211
01:06:37,282 --> 01:06:40,722
you could go to sleep in whatever, 2013 or something,

1212
01:06:40,722 --> 01:06:41,282
and people would say,

1213
01:06:41,282 --> 01:06:43,522
oh, Bitcoin crashed 90% to $2.

1214
01:06:44,242 --> 01:06:45,682
And then you can wake up two years later,

1215
01:06:45,682 --> 01:06:46,482
and people will say,

1216
01:06:46,482 --> 01:06:51,602
oh, Bitcoin crashed 50% to $700 or something.

1217
01:06:51,602 --> 01:06:52,562
And then you can go to sleep,

1218
01:06:52,562 --> 01:06:53,442
and then wake up and you can say,

1219
01:06:53,442 --> 01:06:54,962
oh, Bitcoin crashed again.

1220
01:06:54,962 --> 01:06:57,682
It crashed in, you know, in, um...

1221
01:06:57,682 --> 01:06:58,642
I know, I've seen the video.

1222
01:06:58,642 --> 01:06:59,922
This guy did a YouTube video of it.

1223
01:06:59,922 --> 01:07:03,602
Bitcoin crashed 40% to $6,000.

1224
01:07:05,522 --> 01:07:08,002
But I'm the one that's being the most honest about this.

1225
01:07:08,962 --> 01:07:11,042
I am the one that's being the most honest about this,

1226
01:07:11,042 --> 01:07:13,362
more honest than anyone else in the fucking space.

1227
01:07:14,002 --> 01:07:15,602
I am the one that tells you

1228
01:07:15,602 --> 01:07:18,402
that Hex and every other cryptocurrency that's not a stablecoin

1229
01:07:18,402 --> 01:07:21,122
is extremely likely to drop 85% to 95%.

1230
01:07:22,162 --> 01:07:24,802
Do you think Pomp is going on television saying that?

1231
01:07:24,802 --> 01:07:25,762
No, he's saying,

1232
01:07:25,762 --> 01:07:26,802
if you don't believe in Bitcoin,

1233
01:07:26,802 --> 01:07:28,562
you don't believe in cryptography.

1234
01:07:28,562 --> 01:07:29,762
That's what he's fucking saying.

1235
01:07:31,442 --> 01:07:33,202
So I'm the honest one that tells people

1236
01:07:33,202 --> 01:07:35,602
what is very likely to actually happen.

1237
01:07:35,602 --> 01:07:37,842
I'm the one that's out competing scams for resources

1238
01:07:37,842 --> 01:07:40,642
and saving people from losing all their money to a scam.

1239
01:07:40,642 --> 01:07:43,042
I'm the one that's building new and innovative game theory,

1240
01:07:43,042 --> 01:07:45,442
monetizing time instead of hash rate.

1241
01:07:45,442 --> 01:07:47,122
I'm the one that's improving the environment,

1242
01:07:47,122 --> 01:07:50,322
getting the miners to destroy it less by not overpaying them,

1243
01:07:50,322 --> 01:07:52,642
by just paying them fees instead of inflation.

1244
01:07:53,202 --> 01:07:55,202
I'm the one giving people ability to get,

1245
01:07:55,762 --> 01:07:58,562
you know, perhaps very wealthy if things work out,

1246
01:07:59,362 --> 01:08:00,482
giving them free coins.

1247
01:08:01,122 --> 01:08:02,882
I'm only giving free coins to Bitcoiners.

1248
01:08:02,882 --> 01:08:04,562
There's so many amazing things here.

1249
01:08:04,562 --> 01:08:08,322
And yet I get screamed at and yelled at constantly

1250
01:08:08,322 --> 01:08:13,282
for writing code that is openly viewable and audited and awesome.

1251
01:08:13,282 --> 01:08:15,202
And everyone that uses it likes it very much.

1252
01:08:15,762 --> 01:08:17,922
But the whole rest of the world has never used it.

1253
01:08:17,922 --> 01:08:19,602
They just scream at the top of their lungs,

1254
01:08:19,602 --> 01:08:21,522
scam, scammer, scam, scammer, scam.

1255
01:08:21,522 --> 01:08:22,162
And you're like, why?

1256
01:08:22,882 --> 01:08:24,242
Oh, I'll tell you why.

1257
01:08:24,242 --> 01:08:26,482
Lately, what people are talking about is

1258
01:08:26,482 --> 01:08:29,602
there's an origin address that gets half of the bonuses.

1259
01:08:30,562 --> 01:08:32,722
So right now, from what I've seen in the block explorer,

1260
01:08:32,722 --> 01:08:33,922
it looks like it's gotten 45%.

1261
01:08:35,922 --> 01:08:37,122
People are like, I hate it.

1262
01:08:37,122 --> 01:08:37,842
I hate it.

1263
01:08:37,842 --> 01:08:38,802
Like, okay, you hate that.

1264
01:08:39,762 --> 01:08:42,882
XLM went top 10 crypto with 80% in the foundation.

1265
01:08:43,602 --> 01:08:47,282
XRP went top two crypto with 60%

1266
01:08:47,762 --> 01:08:49,602
and basically a single party.

1267
01:08:50,242 --> 01:08:52,562
Let's look at what the other top 10 cryptos did.

1268
01:08:52,562 --> 01:08:56,402
And let me see their ownership structure.

1269
01:08:56,402 --> 01:09:00,002
And what you'll find is that a lot of most, I would say,

1270
01:09:00,002 --> 01:09:02,402
cryptocurrencies that have done very well and entered the top 10

1271
01:09:02,962 --> 01:09:05,922
do have some giant ass whales that hold some.

1272
01:09:05,922 --> 01:09:08,002
And so the game isn't actually destroying whales,

1273
01:09:08,002 --> 01:09:09,602
it's trying to become a whale.

1274
01:09:09,602 --> 01:09:11,842
But since no one else studies the top 10

1275
01:09:11,842 --> 01:09:14,242
and they don't even know about some of these projects,

1276
01:09:14,242 --> 01:09:15,762
they just scream scam.

1277
01:09:15,842 --> 01:09:17,522
And really, if you think about it,

1278
01:09:17,522 --> 01:09:19,922
how much extra price appreciation do you have to have

1279
01:09:19,922 --> 01:09:21,522
to make up for somebody getting 45%?

1280
01:09:23,042 --> 01:09:25,842
A 1.6X, a 1.8X or something?

1281
01:09:27,042 --> 01:09:29,202
That's not, doesn't seem like a big price to pay

1282
01:09:29,202 --> 01:09:30,802
for the thing existing in the first place.

1283
01:09:31,842 --> 01:09:33,682
Would you prefer it not exist at all?

1284
01:09:33,682 --> 01:09:36,322
Because that was the other option, right?

1285
01:09:36,322 --> 01:09:37,522
Yeah, well, you raised some interesting points.

1286
01:09:37,522 --> 01:09:39,042
One, I have a question.

1287
01:09:39,042 --> 01:09:42,802
So when you, the only people getting free coins

1288
01:09:42,802 --> 01:09:44,802
are Bitcoin UTXOs.

1289
01:09:44,802 --> 01:09:46,962
And referrers, but they got to kind of get referrals, right?

1290
01:09:48,882 --> 01:09:53,602
Oh yeah, but they only get the referral from the claimed Bitcoin.

1291
01:09:53,602 --> 01:09:54,562
Or transformed.

1292
01:09:54,562 --> 01:09:57,442
They also get, if you transform Ethereum into HEX.

1293
01:09:58,082 --> 01:09:59,522
Ah, I see, okay.

1294
01:10:00,962 --> 01:10:03,762
But there's no, you know, day one,

1295
01:10:03,762 --> 01:10:07,522
it's all credited to December 1st, 7 p.m.

1296
01:10:08,162 --> 01:10:09,602
Bitcoin UTXOs, right?

1297
01:10:09,602 --> 01:10:10,102
Yep.

1298
01:10:10,962 --> 01:10:12,722
And it's really the first block after that moment,

1299
01:10:12,722 --> 01:10:13,682
but it's close enough.

1300
01:10:14,962 --> 01:10:17,122
Yeah, well, I originally take as a, you know,

1301
01:10:17,122 --> 01:10:21,762
I do take the Dan Krawitz original view of hard forks,

1302
01:10:21,762 --> 01:10:23,122
which is that you really should just,

1303
01:10:25,762 --> 01:10:29,042
you should just not complain

1304
01:10:29,042 --> 01:10:31,842
about getting a free experiment.

1305
01:10:32,962 --> 01:10:34,482
So that's kind of interesting.

1306
01:10:34,482 --> 01:10:38,082
I have another point about, yes,

1307
01:10:38,082 --> 01:10:40,242
one thing that always made me curious

1308
01:10:40,242 --> 01:10:44,482
was there was Zcash and then there was the fork of Zcash

1309
01:10:44,482 --> 01:10:46,882
that had all of the, you know,

1310
01:10:46,882 --> 01:10:49,682
the founder inflation tax stuff removed.

1311
01:10:49,682 --> 01:10:50,242
Yep.

1312
01:10:50,242 --> 01:10:51,602
And I thought, you know,

1313
01:10:51,602 --> 01:10:54,002
I definitely, if you had asked me years ago to predict,

1314
01:10:54,722 --> 01:10:58,082
or as a student of economics to predict or whatever,

1315
01:10:58,082 --> 01:10:59,202
you would say, of course,

1316
01:10:59,922 --> 01:11:05,122
of course the one without the extra inflation taxes will do better.

1317
01:11:05,122 --> 01:11:07,762
It will just, at best, it will copy the first project.

1318
01:11:09,042 --> 01:11:09,682
Will copy any-

1319
01:11:09,682 --> 01:11:10,722
It never works.

1320
01:11:10,722 --> 01:11:12,162
It never works anywhere.

1321
01:11:12,162 --> 01:11:13,682
It doesn't even work in normal serials.

1322
01:11:13,682 --> 01:11:14,642
It doesn't work in deodorant.

1323
01:11:14,642 --> 01:11:18,882
Well, even though the inflation tax in Zcash is-

1324
01:11:18,882 --> 01:11:20,482
20%. It was 20%.

1325
01:11:20,482 --> 01:11:21,282
That's probably about 10.

1326
01:11:22,002 --> 01:11:23,922
People do not seem to care.

1327
01:11:23,922 --> 01:11:24,562
Yep.

1328
01:11:24,562 --> 01:11:26,802
They have to somehow face,

1329
01:11:26,802 --> 01:11:29,922
I have to somehow, I have to, you know,

1330
01:11:29,922 --> 01:11:30,722
you know what I mean?

1331
01:11:30,722 --> 01:11:32,082
This is like refutes-

1332
01:11:32,082 --> 01:11:32,722
Yep.

1333
01:11:32,722 --> 01:11:35,522
This refutes this belief that I had.

1334
01:11:35,522 --> 01:11:38,322
And so I'm forced to believe that people really just,

1335
01:11:38,322 --> 01:11:41,602
out of some kind of ethical, cultural reason,

1336
01:11:41,602 --> 01:11:42,802
some kind of curiosity,

1337
01:11:43,282 --> 01:11:44,322
it's just a shelling point.

1338
01:11:45,922 --> 01:11:49,522
They prefer to, they prefer to,

1339
01:11:49,522 --> 01:11:50,562
but what is the shelling point?

1340
01:11:50,562 --> 01:11:52,082
The code or the brand?

1341
01:11:52,082 --> 01:11:53,922
Like, it doesn't really make sense because-

1342
01:11:53,922 --> 01:11:54,722
The ticker symbol.

1343
01:11:56,322 --> 01:11:56,822
Sorry?

1344
01:11:57,362 --> 01:11:59,282
It's the ticker symbol and everything tied to it.

1345
01:11:59,282 --> 01:12:00,562
Yeah, the ticker symbol.

1346
01:12:00,562 --> 01:12:01,842
If you make a new fork of Bitcoin-

1347
01:12:01,842 --> 01:12:02,562
They're different, you know,

1348
01:12:02,562 --> 01:12:04,642
some exchanges have different ticker symbols.

1349
01:12:04,642 --> 01:12:07,122
Yeah, so I'm not really saying the letters.

1350
01:12:07,682 --> 01:12:08,402
I'm saying that

1351
01:12:08,962 --> 01:12:11,202
people buy this shit not to use it.

1352
01:12:11,202 --> 01:12:12,722
They buy it to get rich.

1353
01:12:12,722 --> 01:12:14,722
And since they're buying it to get rich,

1354
01:12:14,722 --> 01:12:16,242
it's a Keynesian beauty contest

1355
01:12:16,242 --> 01:12:18,242
and they only give a fuck about what other people are buying.

1356
01:12:18,242 --> 01:12:20,562
You would think that they would care even more.

1357
01:12:20,562 --> 01:12:22,962
You'd think that it'd be even easier to get rich

1358
01:12:22,962 --> 01:12:24,482
without the inflation tax.

1359
01:12:24,482 --> 01:12:25,682
You were just complaining earlier

1360
01:12:25,682 --> 01:12:27,442
about miners dumping the coins.

1361
01:12:27,442 --> 01:12:28,482
Yep, you know what?

1362
01:12:28,482 --> 01:12:29,442
I have an example for you

1363
01:12:29,442 --> 01:12:31,122
that I think could prove this for you.

1364
01:12:31,122 --> 01:12:32,402
I just think it blew my mind,

1365
01:12:32,402 --> 01:12:36,402
this fact that whatever, Z Classic or whatever it was,

1366
01:12:36,562 --> 01:12:41,362
would be just consistently underperforming to Zcash.

1367
01:12:41,362 --> 01:12:44,402
I just find that it was a big eye-opener for me.

1368
01:12:44,402 --> 01:12:44,962
I just-

1369
01:12:44,962 --> 01:12:45,442
So if you-

1370
01:12:45,442 --> 01:12:48,002
I had to learn from the market too.

1371
01:12:48,002 --> 01:12:49,682
I didn't think the most used cryptocurrency

1372
01:12:49,682 --> 01:12:50,882
in the world would be a stablecoin

1373
01:12:50,882 --> 01:12:52,722
and I had to learn from the market.

1374
01:12:52,722 --> 01:12:53,362
You know, I thought,

1375
01:12:53,362 --> 01:12:55,362
oh, you can't have 80% in a foundation.

1376
01:12:55,362 --> 01:12:56,962
There's no way, it's just unfair.

1377
01:12:56,962 --> 01:12:58,722
Nope, turns out it works really well.

1378
01:12:58,722 --> 01:13:01,682
What matters isn't the ownership structure,

1379
01:13:01,682 --> 01:13:03,122
it's that no one sells.

1380
01:13:03,122 --> 01:13:04,402
It doesn't matter if you're a broker,

1381
01:13:04,402 --> 01:13:05,842
it's that no one sells.

1382
01:13:05,842 --> 01:13:07,922
Doesn't matter who the fuck doesn't sell, right?

1383
01:13:07,922 --> 01:13:12,722
Hey, I've got a guy with 80%, he never sells, okay?

1384
01:13:12,722 --> 01:13:14,802
Now I've got two guys with 40%, they never sell.

1385
01:13:14,802 --> 01:13:17,522
Okay, now I've got 10 guys with 8%, they never sell.

1386
01:13:17,522 --> 01:13:20,002
It doesn't matter what the type of person is

1387
01:13:20,002 --> 01:13:21,522
as long as they never sell.

1388
01:13:21,522 --> 01:13:25,442
That's the important part of cryptocurrency going up

1389
01:13:25,442 --> 01:13:27,442
is that people just don't sell it.

1390
01:13:27,442 --> 01:13:29,842
And in fact, most people don't sell their Bitcoin

1391
01:13:29,842 --> 01:13:32,082
because what really would you sell it for?

1392
01:13:32,082 --> 01:13:33,202
No one accepts that shit.

1393
01:13:33,202 --> 01:13:34,402
You're gonna sell it back for cash

1394
01:13:34,402 --> 01:13:35,682
and pay some big capital gains?

1395
01:13:36,322 --> 01:13:38,882
You know, like it's not-

1396
01:13:38,882 --> 01:13:41,602
All the cutthroat, dogmatically rational people

1397
01:13:42,242 --> 01:13:45,762
would be in Z Classic, but then they would sell

1398
01:13:45,762 --> 01:13:47,362
because they're too rational.

1399
01:13:48,002 --> 01:13:51,842
The idealist believers are in Zcash

1400
01:13:51,842 --> 01:13:53,842
and they don't sell and that is why

1401
01:13:53,842 --> 01:13:56,002
price stays up in your view.

1402
01:13:56,002 --> 01:13:57,442
Although I have to tell you that I don't really think

1403
01:13:57,442 --> 01:13:58,882
selling makes the price go down either

1404
01:13:58,882 --> 01:14:01,202
because every time you sell, someone else is buying

1405
01:14:01,202 --> 01:14:03,442
so they actually don't want to make an event.

1406
01:14:03,442 --> 01:14:06,162
But I know what you're saying, you used an inflation tax

1407
01:14:06,162 --> 01:14:09,682
and people are readjusting their portfolio

1408
01:14:09,682 --> 01:14:13,442
to claim more of society's resources

1409
01:14:13,442 --> 01:14:15,682
and surrender some of the inflation tax.

1410
01:14:15,682 --> 01:14:17,442
I know what you mean when you say that.

1411
01:14:18,722 --> 01:14:20,722
I assure you that people selling

1412
01:14:20,722 --> 01:14:22,642
does make the price of things go down.

1413
01:14:22,642 --> 01:14:24,882
Every time someone sells, someone else is buying.

1414
01:14:24,882 --> 01:14:26,242
It's the exact same event.

1415
01:14:26,242 --> 01:14:27,282
No, it is not.

1416
01:14:28,162 --> 01:14:29,522
It is not at all.

1417
01:14:29,522 --> 01:14:32,882
Because you're missing a very important piece of data

1418
01:14:32,882 --> 01:14:35,522
which is the price at which the event is occurring.

1419
01:14:35,522 --> 01:14:39,602
And so yes, one seller always has a buyer

1420
01:14:39,602 --> 01:14:41,362
but the fucking price changes.

1421
01:14:41,362 --> 01:14:43,602
And that's what slippage is literally in an order book.

1422
01:14:43,602 --> 01:14:44,162
Yeah, you are right.

1423
01:14:44,162 --> 01:14:45,922
It's a different side of the order book.

1424
01:14:45,922 --> 01:14:46,802
I agree.

1425
01:14:46,802 --> 01:14:50,002
But it's not merely, it's current owners

1426
01:14:50,002 --> 01:14:53,682
and prospective owners agreeing at lower prices.

1427
01:14:53,682 --> 01:14:54,082
Yes.

1428
01:14:54,082 --> 01:14:55,522
At that point it becomes a tautology

1429
01:14:55,522 --> 01:14:57,122
of course that would lower the price.

1430
01:14:57,122 --> 01:14:58,322
Right, okay.

1431
01:14:58,322 --> 01:15:00,642
That's the reason the price has moved so much.

1432
01:15:00,688 --> 01:15:02,688
Even though there's always a buyer for a seller.

1433
01:15:02,688 --> 01:15:11,688
So my point is, I saw a lot of things that were wrong with crypto and I fixed them
and I fixed them and I fixed them and I fixed them.

1434
01:15:11,688 --> 01:15:19,688
And we've got amazing product market fit now. We've got amazing adoption now. We're
on 10 exchanges in like 11 days.

1435
01:15:20,688 --> 01:15:25,688
We've got like three stats websites that there's every possible statistic you could
think about.

1436
01:15:25,688 --> 01:15:29,688
How long people are staking, what the average stake is, what the median stake is,
what the late penalties are.

1437
01:15:29,688 --> 01:15:33,688
Oh, there's more things in this. If you don't...

1438
01:15:33,688 --> 01:15:36,688
Lighting a mousetrap.

1439
01:15:36,688 --> 01:15:44,688
Yes, we built a better mousetrap. If you don't end your stake when you said you
would, you start getting destroyed by fees.

1440
01:15:44,688 --> 01:15:49,688
And half those fees go to the other stakers and half those fees go to this origin
address.

1441
01:15:49,688 --> 01:15:52,688
So the origin address basically just gets a copy of whatever bonuses you got.

1442
01:15:52,688 --> 01:15:53,688
So if you've got a speed bonus...

1443
01:15:53,688 --> 01:15:56,688
You have your money in the vault but you don't take it out?

1444
01:15:56,688 --> 01:15:59,688
Yeah, then you start getting annihilated by fees.

1445
01:15:59,688 --> 01:16:07,688
That's kind of funny. And it's your advantage to have other people forget or have
their computer catch on fire than they're supposed to.

1446
01:16:08,688 --> 01:16:13,688
Or to have Ethereum miners or whatever censor they are.

1447
01:16:13,688 --> 01:16:15,688
All that shit. True.

1448
01:16:15,688 --> 01:16:16,688
Okay, that sounds cool.

1449
01:16:16,688 --> 01:16:17,688
It's pretty crazy.

1450
01:16:17,688 --> 01:16:19,688
It does sound crazy, yes.

1451
01:16:19,688 --> 01:16:21,688
How do we cancel the crazy out a little bit?

1452
01:16:21,688 --> 01:16:25,688
So first, the reason that exists is someone has to update the system state.

1453
01:16:25,688 --> 01:16:30,688
And you are the one that created shares which diluted everyone else and made
everyone else get paid less.

1454
01:16:30,688 --> 01:16:34,688
And so you need to pull your shares out because there's no automatic in blockchain.

1455
01:16:34,688 --> 01:16:35,688
Someone has to run the software.

1456
01:16:35,688 --> 01:16:37,688
So in Hex, you run the software.

1457
01:16:37,688 --> 01:16:39,688
Only you commit your own coins.

1458
01:16:39,688 --> 01:16:40,688
Only you commit your own rewards.

1459
01:16:40,688 --> 01:16:42,688
Only you invented your private keys.

1460
01:16:42,688 --> 01:16:44,688
No one else can do it for you.

1461
01:16:44,688 --> 01:16:45,688
You're doing all the work.

1462
01:16:45,688 --> 01:16:46,688
Just like a Bitcoin miner.

1463
01:16:46,688 --> 01:16:48,688
A Bitcoin miner invents his own rewards.

1464
01:16:48,688 --> 01:16:49,688
He doesn't ask anyone for them.

1465
01:16:49,688 --> 01:16:50,688
No one hands them to him.

1466
01:16:50,688 --> 01:16:52,688
He makes his own rewards for himself.

1467
01:16:52,688 --> 01:16:53,688
And Hex works the same way.

1468
01:16:53,688 --> 01:16:56,688
You make your own rewards for yourself.

1469
01:16:57,688 --> 01:17:03,688
So when you make a stake, it creates shares.

1470
01:17:03,688 --> 01:17:06,688
We have a share price that only goes up forever.

1471
01:17:06,688 --> 01:17:07,688
It's how we do compounding.

1472
01:17:07,688 --> 01:17:11,688
Otherwise, short stakes would beat long stakes by continually recompounding.

1473
01:17:11,688 --> 01:17:16,688
And so we have longer stakes outperforming shorter stakes by having a share price
that only goes up.

1474
01:17:16,688 --> 01:17:21,688
So that if you end your stake, the system looks to see if you're the highest profit
that's ever been made.

1475
01:17:21,688 --> 01:17:23,688
And if it is, you get set as the new price.

1476
01:17:24,688 --> 01:17:27,688
So then if you try and get back in, you do absolutely no better than you left.

1477
01:17:27,688 --> 01:17:29,688
You get the same shares that you left with.

1478
01:17:29,688 --> 01:17:33,688
But everyone else that had a lower ratio profit than you did, they end up getting
worse.

1479
01:17:33,688 --> 01:17:35,688
If they have to get back in, they get less shares.

1480
01:17:35,688 --> 01:17:38,688
It's very confusing for me.

1481
01:17:38,688 --> 01:17:41,688
When you say share price, you mean the price of Hex for ETH?

1482
01:17:41,688 --> 01:17:42,688
No.

1483
01:17:42,688 --> 01:17:43,688
The amount of shares that you get.

1484
01:17:43,688 --> 01:17:45,688
When you stake, you get...

1485
01:17:45,688 --> 01:17:46,688
Right.

1486
01:17:46,688 --> 01:17:51,688
So when you stake, the amount of shares that you get for your stake is based on the
share price.

1487
01:17:51,688 --> 01:17:52,688
I see.

1488
01:17:52,688 --> 01:17:53,688
Okay.

1489
01:17:53,688 --> 01:17:59,688
And it's neat to have a chart of something that only goes up, which is
mathematically equivalent to compounding.

1490
01:17:59,688 --> 01:18:01,688
So we could either inflate...

1491
01:18:01,688 --> 01:18:04,688
It's computationally inefficient to inflate the shares for all the old guys that
were in early.

1492
01:18:04,688 --> 01:18:08,688
It's more efficient to just reduce the shares for the new guys by having a share
price.

1493
01:18:08,688 --> 01:18:10,688
And we have a cool price chart that only goes up.

1494
01:18:10,688 --> 01:18:12,688
It's awesome.

1495
01:18:12,688 --> 01:18:13,688
I kind of invented it.

1496
01:18:13,688 --> 01:18:15,688
I'm pretty excited about it.

1497
01:18:15,688 --> 01:18:21,688
I've never seen any other system that uses maximum ROI of any participant to set the
new share price.

1498
01:18:21,688 --> 01:18:25,688
I invented that, and it's amazing, I think.

1499
01:18:25,688 --> 01:18:27,688
That sounds at least intriguing.

1500
01:18:27,688 --> 01:18:28,688
Yeah.

1501
01:18:28,688 --> 01:18:30,688
So there's a shitload of innovation here.

1502
01:18:30,688 --> 01:18:32,688
A shitload.

1503
01:18:32,688 --> 01:18:35,688
And people are just too dumb to notice.

1504
01:18:35,688 --> 01:18:36,688
I don't get it.

1505
01:18:36,688 --> 01:18:40,688
They just keep yelling scam and don't actually look at what we're doing.

1506
01:18:40,688 --> 01:18:41,688
So it's just like...

1507
01:18:41,688 --> 01:18:46,688
It's very advisable for people to be very cautious about anything they invest in.

1508
01:18:46,688 --> 01:18:47,688
Sure.

1509
01:18:47,688 --> 01:18:52,688
Certainly if you're being given something for free, again, it's a very clever way of
stepping around.

1510
01:18:52,688 --> 01:18:54,688
Yeah, we do a lot of clever stuff here, man.

1511
01:18:54,688 --> 01:18:56,688
So I wanted to tell you there's two more parts of that.

1512
01:18:56,688 --> 01:19:00,688
You can emergency end your stake, and you'll get annihilated by fees,

1513
01:19:00,688 --> 01:19:04,688
dependent on how much of your stake you said you were going to do and you didn't do
it.

1514
01:19:04,688 --> 01:19:08,688
So if you serve half your stake, you'll get out with your principal.

1515
01:19:08,688 --> 01:19:10,688
Pretty sure.

1516
01:19:10,688 --> 01:19:14,688
If you don't serve half your stake, you're going to get your principal eaten into.

1517
01:19:14,688 --> 01:19:19,688
So someone for fun made a 5,555-day stake, which is the max, and then ended it the
next day.

1518
01:19:19,688 --> 01:19:24,688
I think he got beat for like 98% or 86% or something.

1519
01:19:24,688 --> 01:19:26,688
That's how much he got beat for.

1520
01:19:26,688 --> 01:19:27,688
Got it.

1521
01:19:27,688 --> 01:19:30,688
And guess who that penalty goes to?

1522
01:19:30,688 --> 01:19:34,688
It goes to half the stakers and half the origin.

1523
01:19:34,688 --> 01:19:35,688
Half the origin?

1524
01:19:35,688 --> 01:19:36,688
Sure.

1525
01:19:36,688 --> 01:19:37,688
The origin.

1526
01:19:37,688 --> 01:19:38,688
Yeah, the origin's happy.

1527
01:19:38,688 --> 01:19:39,688
The king of the castle.

1528
01:19:39,688 --> 01:19:40,688
The origin's a happy camper.

1529
01:19:40,688 --> 01:19:41,688
Okay, great.

1530
01:19:41,688 --> 01:19:42,688
And you know what?

1531
01:19:43,688 --> 01:19:48,688
The guy that invented XRP's a happy camper, and Vitalik's a happy camper, and
Charlie Lee's a happy camper,

1532
01:19:48,688 --> 01:19:50,688
and fucking Fluffy Pony.

1533
01:19:50,688 --> 01:19:54,688
You know, it turns out people that invent things that get mass adoption, they do
well,

1534
01:19:54,688 --> 01:19:56,688
and that makes the world a better place.

1535
01:19:56,688 --> 01:19:58,688
Yeah, well, there's a kind of privatization.

1536
01:19:58,688 --> 01:20:05,688
There's a commons problem for these open-source software projects that partially is
addressed

1537
01:20:05,688 --> 01:20:11,688
by making someone the owner.

1538
01:20:11,688 --> 01:20:14,688
Not really what I like, but it does happen.

1539
01:20:14,688 --> 01:20:15,688
Yes, it's true.

1540
01:20:15,688 --> 01:20:19,688
When there's one big owner, they are the—it privatizes the project.

1541
01:20:19,688 --> 01:20:20,688
It usually works.

1542
01:20:20,688 --> 01:20:21,688
It usually works.

1543
01:20:21,688 --> 01:20:27,688
Most public companies were private companies first, and they were successful as
private companies.

1544
01:20:27,688 --> 01:20:31,688
Oh, that's not what I mean about being publicly or privately traded.

1545
01:20:31,688 --> 01:20:32,688
I'm just saying like—

1546
01:20:32,688 --> 01:20:35,688
I'm talking about centralization of power structure.

1547
01:20:35,688 --> 01:20:39,688
If you advocate for Bitcoin, for example, as Roger Ver did.

1548
01:20:39,688 --> 01:20:40,688
Roger Ver is another example.

1549
01:20:40,688 --> 01:20:43,688
In the early days, you advertised for Bitcoin.

1550
01:20:43,688 --> 01:20:48,688
Those benefits accrue to all the Bitcoin holders, not just you.

1551
01:20:48,688 --> 01:20:53,688
So it benefits—it's a little bit more logical if you are a very large holder.

1552
01:20:53,688 --> 01:20:56,688
Depending on whether they had a three-year time horizon or not.

1553
01:20:56,688 --> 01:21:01,688
If you're a Bitcoin marketer guy and you're not honest like I am and tell people
that it crashes 85% rather often,

1554
01:21:01,688 --> 01:21:05,688
and you get someone to buy into Bitcoin that doesn't have a three-year investment
horizon,

1555
01:21:05,688 --> 01:21:08,688
you could be destroying that guy's life because he could be buying the fucking time.

1556
01:21:08,688 --> 01:21:09,688
It's true.

1557
01:21:09,688 --> 01:21:14,688
It's funny that you've mentioned that because I do always tell people that they
should be thinking about it for three years.

1558
01:21:14,688 --> 01:21:15,688
Yep.

1559
01:21:15,688 --> 01:21:19,688
Which is interesting that you use the same number as I do.

1560
01:21:19,688 --> 01:21:20,688
It's true.

1561
01:21:20,688 --> 01:21:21,688
It's on the chart.

1562
01:21:21,688 --> 01:21:23,688
It's on the fucking chart.

1563
01:21:23,688 --> 01:21:29,688
It really doesn't go down 85% if you zoom out, but that's only if you zoom in.

1564
01:21:29,688 --> 01:21:30,688
Yep.

1565
01:21:30,688 --> 01:21:34,688
So you have to—I speak truth about this stuff.

1566
01:21:34,688 --> 01:21:39,688
And I'm very specific about what I say, and I do the best I can to educate people.

1567
01:21:39,688 --> 01:21:46,688
And it just blows my mind that people dare come to me and call me a scammer when
I've had no way to pay me money.

1568
01:21:46,688 --> 01:21:52,688
No donation address, no shopping cart, no fucking paid groups, nothing.

1569
01:21:52,688 --> 01:21:53,688
I give away free books.

1570
01:21:53,688 --> 01:21:54,688
I wrote two self-help books.

1571
01:21:54,688 --> 01:21:58,688
I give away free videos with ads turned off.

1572
01:21:58,688 --> 01:22:03,688
I give away free trading chatroom, price calls, now free tokens.

1573
01:22:03,688 --> 01:22:05,688
And I've been doing this for years.

1574
01:22:05,688 --> 01:22:08,688
And how dare people come and call me a scammer?

1575
01:22:08,688 --> 01:22:09,688
It just blows my mind.

1576
01:22:09,688 --> 01:22:13,688
It's like, goddamn, what is fucking wrong with you fucking people?

1577
01:22:13,688 --> 01:22:16,688
Well, you know, you can see how it does look very suspicious.

1578
01:22:16,688 --> 01:22:18,688
Sure, it looks that way.

1579
01:22:18,688 --> 01:22:25,688
But you have to fucking—if you don't like it when fiat people call Bitcoin a scam,
then you got to stop calling everything else a scam.

1580
01:22:25,688 --> 01:22:26,688
Right?

1581
01:22:26,688 --> 01:22:29,688
Fiat people call Bitcoin a scam because they don't understand it.

1582
01:22:30,688 --> 01:22:34,688
Bitcoin people and other crypto people call Hex a scam because they don't understand
it.

1583
01:22:34,688 --> 01:22:35,688
It's hypocrisy.

1584
01:22:35,688 --> 01:22:37,688
Be the change you want to see in the world.

1585
01:22:37,688 --> 01:22:38,688
If you're tired of being called a scam—

1586
01:22:38,688 --> 01:22:48,688
Bitcoin and Hex are both creative in a sense that they sort of are new and unlike
older things.

1587
01:22:48,688 --> 01:22:52,688
But, you know, the phrase creative accounting is kind of negative.

1588
01:22:52,688 --> 01:22:53,688
It's kind of a slur.

1589
01:22:53,688 --> 01:22:56,688
It's saying, like, why isn't it clear?

1590
01:22:56,688 --> 01:23:06,688
Why isn't it—you know, if you switch from the way things were done in the past to
something new, you could be doing that for good purposes or deceptive.

1591
01:23:06,688 --> 01:23:12,688
Well, I mean, look, you could ask yourself whether Bitcoin has been a positive
change in the world if you want to take that tact.

1592
01:23:12,688 --> 01:23:21,688
It really depends on whether your kid died from drugs in the dark net or not or
whether, you know, you were able to send your mom some money that needed it in
Venezuela.

1593
01:23:21,688 --> 01:23:26,688
Or there's a lot of—like any technology, there's pluses and minuses.

1594
01:23:26,688 --> 01:23:33,688
And I think as long as human beings are in general better than they are worse, the
technological advances will be better than they are worse.

1595
01:23:34,688 --> 01:23:36,688
So technology is a force multiplier.

1596
01:23:36,688 --> 01:23:42,688
And if people generally do good things, then we will generally have a better world
with more technology.

1597
01:23:42,688 --> 01:23:45,688
If people turn evil, then we should lose the technology.

1598
01:23:45,688 --> 01:23:52,688
You might think people are actually—people are pretty good generally.

1599
01:23:52,688 --> 01:23:53,688
Yep.

1600
01:23:53,688 --> 01:23:54,688
The world wouldn't work.

1601
01:23:54,688 --> 01:23:56,688
The world would be more fucked up.

1602
01:23:56,688 --> 01:23:57,688
It wouldn't.

1603
01:23:57,688 --> 01:23:58,688
You're right.

1604
01:23:58,688 --> 01:24:06,688
That's a good point, which is that we wouldn't—if really only the law enforcement
was keeping everyone from robbing each other, it actually—

1605
01:24:06,688 --> 01:24:07,688
It doesn't scale.

1606
01:24:07,688 --> 01:24:08,688
Yeah, unable to.

1607
01:24:08,688 --> 01:24:09,688
So, yeah.

1608
01:24:09,688 --> 01:24:10,688
It's asymmetrical.

1609
01:24:10,688 --> 01:24:13,688
It takes like four investigators to solve one small crime.

1610
01:24:13,688 --> 01:24:16,688
But really what holds people in, again, is what's in people's minds, the culture,
but also shame.

1611
01:24:16,688 --> 01:24:24,688
You people would be ashamed of facing their friends and family if they were found to
have taken advantage of people in a desperate time.

1612
01:24:24,688 --> 01:24:25,688
Animals have ethics.

1613
01:24:25,688 --> 01:24:27,688
Animals have ethics.

1614
01:24:27,688 --> 01:24:29,688
Human beings also have ethics.

1615
01:24:29,688 --> 01:24:32,688
There are effective strategies for operating in groups.

1616
01:24:32,688 --> 01:24:36,688
As a matter of fact, I wouldn't be surprised if amoebas had ethics to some degree.

1617
01:24:36,688 --> 01:24:38,688
They understand kin and not kin.

1618
01:24:38,688 --> 01:24:41,688
They understand don't kill people on my team.

1619
01:24:41,688 --> 01:24:42,688
They have norms.

1620
01:24:42,688 --> 01:24:44,688
They certainly have norms.

1621
01:24:44,688 --> 01:24:45,688
Right.

1622
01:24:45,688 --> 01:24:50,688
So there's things that work better and there's things that work worse, and we just
happen to do the same things that dogs do.

1623
01:24:50,688 --> 01:24:53,688
They don't eat their brothers usually.

1624
01:24:53,688 --> 01:24:55,688
They don't eat their parents usually.

1625
01:24:55,688 --> 01:24:56,688
They get along as a team.

1626
01:24:56,688 --> 01:24:57,688
They cooperate.

1627
01:24:57,688 --> 01:24:58,688
We do even better than that.

1628
01:24:58,688 --> 01:25:02,688
We actively talk about right and wrong.

1629
01:25:02,688 --> 01:25:03,688
Sure.

1630
01:25:03,688 --> 01:25:12,688
We have ideas that exist independently of even evolution and things.

1631
01:25:12,688 --> 01:25:15,688
I'm not sure it's made us much more honest than dogs, though.

1632
01:25:15,688 --> 01:25:17,688
I like dogs.

1633
01:25:17,688 --> 01:25:23,688
Our powers, our mental powers are greater, so we can both deceive and tell the truth
easier.

1634
01:25:23,688 --> 01:25:26,688
But deception is also a way to tell the truth.

1635
01:25:26,688 --> 01:25:29,688
Imagine you work as a therapist or something.

1636
01:25:29,688 --> 01:25:32,688
If you can't lie, then people can't tell you the truth.

1637
01:25:32,688 --> 01:25:34,688
You can't do anything about the problems.

1638
01:25:34,688 --> 01:25:35,688
What if you're a spy?

1639
01:25:35,688 --> 01:25:39,688
There's exceptions to most rules.

1640
01:25:39,688 --> 01:25:48,688
I was going to tell you the last thing about that thing that if you don't end your
stake, then you could just lose all your money.

1641
01:25:48,688 --> 01:25:51,688
Anyone else in the world could pull your expired shares out for you.

1642
01:25:51,688 --> 01:25:53,688
It's called the good accounting function.

1643
01:25:53,688 --> 01:25:55,688
You can run the good accounting function.

1644
01:25:55,688 --> 01:26:00,688
You'd want to let people leave it in the vault as long as possible.

1645
01:26:00,688 --> 01:26:04,688
But if you're a nice guy and you don't want to see people burn, maybe you run that
function for them.

1646
01:26:04,688 --> 01:26:06,688
I don't know what's going to happen.

1647
01:26:06,688 --> 01:26:07,688
Yes.

1648
01:26:07,688 --> 01:26:09,688
Well, okay.

1649
01:26:09,688 --> 01:26:12,688
If the world wants to be nice to other people, it can do it.

1650
01:26:12,688 --> 01:26:15,688
It's a very wacky idea.

1651
01:26:15,688 --> 01:26:17,688
How much is the origin address spent?

1652
01:26:17,688 --> 01:26:19,688
Does it spend a lot of hex or any of it?

1653
01:26:19,688 --> 01:26:21,688
It just locks it all up.

1654
01:26:21,688 --> 01:26:26,688
The origin address has been sending to – I'll be specific with my language.

1655
01:26:26,688 --> 01:26:33,688
The origin address appears to have sent to like 10 or 20 addresses, and those
addresses just lock all up their coins.

1656
01:26:33,688 --> 01:26:35,688
I see.

1657
01:26:35,688 --> 01:26:37,688
So the origin has spent something.

1658
01:26:37,688 --> 01:26:38,688
Mostly 10 years.

1659
01:26:38,688 --> 01:26:44,688
The grandchild or the child of the origin address has not spent any.

1660
01:26:44,688 --> 01:26:45,688
No one has like –

1661
01:26:45,688 --> 01:26:52,688
Yes, so if you do the lineage, right, so the energy that has been input to the
origin address and then has ended up in other addresses,

1662
01:26:52,688 --> 01:26:59,688
it's locked almost every single hex it's ever gotten and mostly for 10 years.

1663
01:26:59,688 --> 01:27:00,688
Very interesting.

1664
01:27:00,688 --> 01:27:02,688
Yes.

1665
01:27:02,688 --> 01:27:12,688
Now I think – because like why – if in theory – so if we took a different system,
not hex, a different coin,

1666
01:27:12,688 --> 01:27:21,688
and the founder of that coin had the new coin that he created and Ethereum, which
one do you think he would want to sell?

1667
01:27:21,688 --> 01:27:31,688
Now I can say in this system, in hex, the origin address appears to have divested of
nearly all of its coins,

1668
01:27:31,688 --> 01:27:39,688
and other addresses receive them, and then those other addresses stake nearly all
their coins for mostly 10 years,

1669
01:27:39,688 --> 01:27:44,688
and then what is the flush address done, which is the Ethereum?

1670
01:27:44,688 --> 01:27:46,688
Ethereum has just sat there and done nothing.

1671
01:27:46,688 --> 01:27:53,688
It's got about 42,000 Ethereum, and it moved 195 of them to Binance, and that's it.

1672
01:27:53,688 --> 01:28:03,688
So that's the analysis on what those two addresses have done.

1673
01:28:03,688 --> 01:28:09,688
So in theory, would you rather – if you invented a currency, not hex, if you
invented some other currency,

1674
01:28:09,688 --> 01:28:17,688
and you had a bag of ETH and you had a bag of your currency, which one would you be
more happy to sell?

1675
01:28:17,688 --> 01:28:21,688
The thing you invented and built or the thing that –

1676
01:28:21,688 --> 01:28:22,688
It's very confusing.

1677
01:28:22,688 --> 01:28:23,688
Okay.

1678
01:28:23,688 --> 01:28:24,688
Because –

1679
01:28:24,688 --> 01:28:26,688
Well, aren't you going to – don't you have a coin coming out or something?

1680
01:28:26,688 --> 01:28:30,688
You want to know who else is accepting it, which is – in my view, I'm this network
effects guy.

1681
01:28:30,688 --> 01:28:36,688
I think that the network effects are very, very strong and very important.

1682
01:28:36,688 --> 01:28:39,688
So I think that it's not a – it's a totally different factor.

1683
01:28:39,688 --> 01:28:45,688
But what I – there are at least two things that attracted me to having this
conversation with you,

1684
01:28:45,688 --> 01:28:56,688
which is that the – if I asked you some question like do you aspire to have hex
spent in stores or something,

1685
01:28:57,688 --> 01:29:04,688
and be used as money in like a country, and I'm going to say it doesn't matter what
you answer that question as

1686
01:29:04,688 --> 01:29:10,688
because for BTC, it's sort of like almost the same answer, which is that it's not
really supposed to be about that.

1687
01:29:10,688 --> 01:29:14,688
It's just supposed to be about sound money and holding –

1688
01:29:14,688 --> 01:29:21,688
It was supposed to be about that, but they just gave up on it because it didn't
work, which is okay because store value is bigger money.

1689
01:29:21,688 --> 01:29:25,688
So here's the problem with being a processing network.

1690
01:29:25,688 --> 01:29:32,688
Processing networks has existed as a technology for decades, and it's been
demarginalized and made less profitable because of it.

1691
01:29:32,688 --> 01:29:37,688
So if you look at how much money Visa and MasterCard make,

1692
01:29:37,688 --> 01:29:41,688
and then you tried to make something that offered the same features as them but it
ran on Bitcoin,

1693
01:29:41,688 --> 01:29:44,688
you wouldn't be able to because they're actually very efficient.

1694
01:29:44,688 --> 01:29:52,688
If you say, you know what, we want to have a phone call center that answers these
people's problems when they call 24 hours a day

1695
01:29:52,688 --> 01:29:59,688
and has a dispute resolution system where we look and we see and adjudicate who's
going to get to keep money and who's not,

1696
01:29:59,688 --> 01:30:03,688
and we need to have ATMs all over the world that accept these cards,

1697
01:30:03,688 --> 01:30:08,688
and you start adding all that shit up, Bitcoin would never, ever be able to do it in
like 20 years.

1698
01:30:08,688 --> 01:30:13,688
I totally agree with that, but you understand that Bitcoin's basis for competing
with them,

1699
01:30:13,688 --> 01:30:18,688
even theoretically if it were as a super large block credit card competitor payment
thing,

1700
01:30:18,688 --> 01:30:20,688
it would be on a different basis.

1701
01:30:20,688 --> 01:30:25,688
One would be that it would have no brick and mortar, it would have no lawyers, it
would have no dispute resolution.

1702
01:30:25,688 --> 01:30:27,688
Right, but that's all worse.

1703
01:30:27,688 --> 01:30:30,688
All that shit sucks, that's worse, like it's less features.

1704
01:30:30,688 --> 01:30:38,688
Yeah, so my point is that people think that being a payment network is very
valuable, and they're wrong and they're stupid.

1705
01:30:38,688 --> 01:30:40,688
Being a payment network isn't worth a jack shit.

1706
01:30:40,688 --> 01:30:44,688
What is worth a lot is being something that people buy and never sell,

1707
01:30:44,688 --> 01:30:49,688
and then you just have constant up price pressure with no fucking down price
pressure.

1708
01:30:49,688 --> 01:30:53,688
Yeah, but they're not buying it in order to spend it in a store or anything.

1709
01:30:53,688 --> 01:30:56,688
People don't realize spending it means you're pushing the price down.

1710
01:30:56,688 --> 01:30:59,688
Like when Vitalik donated a few million dollars to the Sense Foundation,

1711
01:30:59,688 --> 01:31:02,688
he pushed the price of Ethereum down because they sold that shit.

1712
01:31:02,688 --> 01:31:05,688
When you spend your crypto, you fuck the price.

1713
01:31:05,688 --> 01:31:09,688
So when you say, hey man, I'm going to support this network, I'm going to buy a
Bitcoin,

1714
01:31:09,688 --> 01:31:12,688
and I'm going to send it over there, and then he's going to sell the Bitcoin.

1715
01:31:12,688 --> 01:31:15,688
Well, guess what, man? The price went up a little, and then it went down a little,

1716
01:31:15,688 --> 01:31:18,688
and it got left about where it started.

1717
01:31:18,688 --> 01:31:24,688
Because if this fantasy of people using the cryptocurrency more made it more
valuable,

1718
01:31:24,688 --> 01:31:28,688
then Ethereum would have gone up in value when they shifted that shitload of
transactions

1719
01:31:28,688 --> 01:31:31,688
off of Omni onto ERC-20 on Ethereum.

1720
01:31:31,688 --> 01:31:36,688
Fucking price didn't go up, the transaction fees went up, the network activity went
up,

1721
01:31:36,688 --> 01:31:38,688
but the fucking price didn't go up. Why?

1722
01:31:38,688 --> 01:31:41,688
Because you only have to pay a penny to get your transaction done.

1723
01:31:41,688 --> 01:31:47,688
So how is adding a bunch of extra penny payments move a fucking $15 billion currency
up?

1724
01:31:47,688 --> 01:31:48,688
It doesn't.

1725
01:31:48,688 --> 01:31:54,688
So this theory that the blockchain that gets used more will be more valuable is
fucking wrong.

1726
01:31:54,688 --> 01:31:55,688
It's not true.

1727
01:31:55,688 --> 01:31:57,688
Omni got used a lot.

1728
01:31:57,688 --> 01:31:59,688
They do less than $300 a day of fucking volume.

1729
01:31:59,688 --> 01:32:04,688
Omni failed entirely, but was actually successful technology for Tether.

1730
01:32:04,688 --> 01:32:09,688
So the concept that network effect will make your cryptocurrency more valuable

1731
01:32:09,688 --> 01:32:14,688
is only true if the network effect is holding and not actually using.

1732
01:32:14,688 --> 01:32:17,688
Because I can show you actually used coins that ain't worth shit.

1733
01:32:17,688 --> 01:32:20,688
And I can show you coins with no use that are worth a lot.

1734
01:32:20,688 --> 01:32:25,688
Earlier you were saying that you wanted to use Ethereum because it was better in
your opinion.

1735
01:32:25,688 --> 01:32:30,688
It's better. The valuation accrues at the endpoints.

1736
01:32:30,688 --> 01:32:33,688
Amazon is one of the richest companies.

1737
01:32:33,688 --> 01:32:36,688
Jeff Bezos is the richest motherfucker in the United States because he owns Amazon.

1738
01:32:36,688 --> 01:32:39,688
Amazon is the richest motherfucker in the United States because they're closest to
the money.

1739
01:32:39,688 --> 01:32:40,688
They're the endpoint.

1740
01:32:40,688 --> 01:32:42,688
They're not a dumb pipe.

1741
01:32:42,688 --> 01:32:43,688
They're not a substrate.

1742
01:32:43,688 --> 01:32:44,688
They're not an ISP.

1743
01:32:44,688 --> 01:32:46,688
They're the endpoint that's the closest to the money.

1744
01:32:46,688 --> 01:32:48,688
HEX is closest to the money.

1745
01:32:48,688 --> 01:32:51,688
Ethereum is a dumb substrate that we operate on.

1746
01:32:51,688 --> 01:32:55,688
So value is likely to accrue at the endpoints that are closest to the customer.

1747
01:32:55,688 --> 01:32:58,688
And the underlying technology is fucking irrelevant to them.

1748
01:32:58,688 --> 01:33:05,688
So when people use HEX and go to go.hex.win or etherscan.io to use it,

1749
01:33:05,688 --> 01:33:06,688
you don't have to go to go.hex.win.

1750
01:33:06,688 --> 01:33:08,688
There's nothing essential going on.

1751
01:33:08,688 --> 01:33:12,688
You can, you know, access the blockchain in many different ways.

1752
01:33:12,688 --> 01:33:18,688
You don't really know that you're using Ethereum at all except for you have to pay a
penny

1753
01:33:18,688 --> 01:33:21,688
or sometimes three pennies to do a transaction.

1754
01:33:21,688 --> 01:33:28,688
And if that goes away, if that little component goes away using what's called
metatransactions

1755
01:33:28,688 --> 01:33:33,688
or there's this EIP that they've got that would allow you to pay fees direct to
miners with ERC20s,

1756
01:33:33,688 --> 01:33:37,688
if either of those things is implemented or becomes more popular,

1757
01:33:37,688 --> 01:33:40,688
like the metatransaction thing is already done.

1758
01:33:40,688 --> 01:33:45,688
It could just be done where you can pay your fees with HEX and never touch ETH at
all.

1759
01:33:45,688 --> 01:33:47,688
Then you wouldn't know there was an ETH network.

1760
01:33:47,688 --> 01:33:48,688
It wouldn't exist to you.

1761
01:33:48,688 --> 01:33:53,688
Yeah, but I think your claim that the network effect is only important when it's
about...

1762
01:33:53,688 --> 01:33:54,688
Only important for price.

1763
01:33:54,688 --> 01:33:56,688
For development, it's important.

1764
01:33:56,688 --> 01:33:58,688
I mean, there's a lot of other shit that's not price.

1765
01:33:58,688 --> 01:34:02,688
You're saying all these things about there's the Uniswap and there's whatever,
Tornado.

1766
01:34:02,688 --> 01:34:04,688
Yeah, that's all because the network effect.

1767
01:34:04,688 --> 01:34:07,688
That is all because of the network effect, for sure.

1768
01:34:07,688 --> 01:34:12,688
So for things improving, network effect is very important for price appreciation.

1769
01:34:12,688 --> 01:34:13,688
And obviously, the US dollar.

1770
01:34:13,688 --> 01:34:17,688
I mean, if I spend the US dollar, I can't spend euros in the United States.

1771
01:34:17,688 --> 01:34:18,688
You can.

1772
01:34:18,688 --> 01:34:19,688
As soon as I go to Europe.

1773
01:34:19,688 --> 01:34:20,688
You can.

1774
01:34:20,688 --> 01:34:21,688
They just don't usually let you.

1775
01:34:21,688 --> 01:34:22,688
You can.

1776
01:34:22,688 --> 01:34:23,688
You can spend euros in the United States.

1777
01:34:23,688 --> 01:34:25,688
You can go to a cash exchange house.

1778
01:34:25,688 --> 01:34:26,688
You really could try.

1779
01:34:26,688 --> 01:34:27,688
Well, no.

1780
01:34:27,688 --> 01:34:31,688
You could go to a cash exchange house and they will accept your euros, which is
spending them,

1781
01:34:31,688 --> 01:34:33,688
and give you another currency.

1782
01:34:33,688 --> 01:34:37,688
The cash exchange place is a special case.

1783
01:34:37,688 --> 01:34:42,688
They specialize in subverting the rule that applies everywhere else.

1784
01:34:42,688 --> 01:34:45,688
Yes, but it is legal for you to spend whatever the fuck you want.

1785
01:34:45,688 --> 01:34:47,688
There is no law in the United States.

1786
01:34:47,688 --> 01:34:51,688
I would dispute the fact that I'm even spending euros at a cash exchange store.

1787
01:34:51,688 --> 01:34:52,688
I don't like going there.

1788
01:34:52,688 --> 01:34:54,688
You're just buying dollars, but whatever.

1789
01:34:54,688 --> 01:34:55,688
It's fine.

1790
01:34:55,688 --> 01:34:57,688
In the United States, you can pay whatever you want.

1791
01:34:58,688 --> 01:35:04,688
You're saying that network effect only matters if it's for...

1792
01:35:04,688 --> 01:35:05,688
No, no.

1793
01:35:05,688 --> 01:35:06,688
I'm not saying network effect doesn't exist.

1794
01:35:06,688 --> 01:35:08,688
I'm not saying Metcalfe's Law isn't important.

1795
01:35:08,688 --> 01:35:10,688
I'm just pointing out.

1796
01:35:10,688 --> 01:35:14,688
I agree with everything that you're saying about how important network effect is and

1797
01:35:14,688 --> 01:35:16,688
how awesome it is and all that shit.

1798
01:35:16,688 --> 01:35:22,688
I'm just pointing out that in crypto, the network effect of adoption is dog shit for

1799
01:35:22,688 --> 01:35:26,688
the price comparing to the network effect of holding.

1800
01:35:26,688 --> 01:35:29,688
Because holding creates a buy and no sell.

1801
01:35:29,688 --> 01:35:32,688
And use creates a buy and a sell.

1802
01:35:32,688 --> 01:35:34,688
And having a sell sucks.

1803
01:35:34,688 --> 01:35:36,688
That's all I'm pointing out.

1804
01:35:36,688 --> 01:35:38,688
I see what you're saying.

1805
01:35:38,688 --> 01:35:41,688
I think I would really frame it that the people who are onboarded...

1806
01:35:41,688 --> 01:35:48,688
No, I made a similar point when I was trying to talk to Vin Armani about when people
are...

1807
01:35:48,688 --> 01:35:52,688
Someone who buys and holds, they pay more of a cost.

1808
01:35:52,688 --> 01:35:55,688
They pay this whole thing and they're holding on to it.

1809
01:35:55,688 --> 01:35:58,688
If they buy Bitcoin, they spend a whole...

1810
01:35:58,688 --> 01:36:01,688
Whatever it was they spent, $10,000 or whatever.

1811
01:36:01,688 --> 01:36:04,688
And so that's a much more reliable signal.

1812
01:36:04,688 --> 01:36:09,688
And someone who merely chooses to accept it in their store, they may not even
receive

1813
01:36:09,688 --> 01:36:10,688
any Bitcoin transactions.

1814
01:36:10,688 --> 01:36:11,688
They may do nothing.

1815
01:36:11,688 --> 01:36:12,688
It may have no effect.

1816
01:36:13,688 --> 01:36:24,688
But similarly, when someone's onboarded to a new crypto, even if it's BTC, a lot of
what

1817
01:36:24,688 --> 01:36:30,688
they learn also applies to the other cryptos, like download a phone wallet, guard
your private

1818
01:36:30,688 --> 01:36:31,688
key or whatever.

1819
01:36:31,688 --> 01:36:36,688
So they're onboarded to all the competitors at the same time, which is the point I
was

1820
01:36:36,688 --> 01:36:40,688
trying to make about Bitcoin Cash versus BTC retail acceptance.

1821
01:36:40,688 --> 01:36:41,688
Right.

1822
01:36:41,688 --> 01:36:42,688
I think that...

1823
01:36:42,688 --> 01:36:43,688
I agree.

1824
01:36:43,688 --> 01:36:44,688
Sort of, I think.

1825
01:36:44,688 --> 01:36:45,688
I think we agree on...

1826
01:36:45,688 --> 01:36:48,688
I don't know of anything I disagree with.

1827
01:36:48,688 --> 01:36:49,688
We do agree a lot.

1828
01:36:49,688 --> 01:36:52,688
It's because we're right.

1829
01:36:52,688 --> 01:36:53,688
We're thoughtful.

1830
01:36:53,688 --> 01:36:54,688
We fucking think.

1831
01:36:54,688 --> 01:37:01,688
Well, it is certainly the case that all the crypto projects compete with each other
and

1832
01:37:01,688 --> 01:37:03,688
that they...

1833
01:37:03,688 --> 01:37:06,688
It's a little bit misleading, though, what you're saying there's a little misleading

1834
01:37:06,688 --> 01:37:07,688
because...

1835
01:37:08,688 --> 01:37:09,688
All right.

1836
01:37:09,688 --> 01:37:10,688
Let's hear it.

1837
01:37:10,688 --> 01:37:13,688
That competition is what caused all the prices to go up.

1838
01:37:13,688 --> 01:37:18,688
So the fact that Ethereum brought all this new money in from a new branch of human
psychology

1839
01:37:18,688 --> 01:37:21,688
that wasn't already cashed out.

1840
01:37:21,688 --> 01:37:25,688
So the libertarian gold bugs, they already blew their loads and bought all the
Bitcoin

1841
01:37:25,688 --> 01:37:28,688
they could buy and they didn't have much left untapped.

1842
01:37:28,688 --> 01:37:34,688
And then the venture capital, Kumbaya VC guys, they weren't all in yet.

1843
01:37:34,688 --> 01:37:38,688
And so they all end into the world computer and then they got wrecked.

1844
01:37:38,688 --> 01:37:40,688
And now we're looking for our next pool.

1845
01:37:40,688 --> 01:37:45,688
And the next pool in crypto that's being wrecked is the people that fall for Ponzi
schemes.

1846
01:37:45,688 --> 01:37:48,688
And then if you want to keep seeing the price go up, you're going to have to find a
new

1847
01:37:48,688 --> 01:37:53,688
pool of untapped capital that you haven't emptied yet to make the price punch up
again

1848
01:37:53,688 --> 01:37:57,688
because everyone else is already all in and working a day job to try and save up
enough

1849
01:37:57,688 --> 01:37:58,688
to buy a bag again.

1850
01:37:58,688 --> 01:38:00,688
This is how crypto works.

1851
01:38:00,688 --> 01:38:04,688
So I bought 30, bought the top, dropped a penny on Gox.

1852
01:38:04,688 --> 01:38:07,688
They rolled the transactions back, but it sure did trade for a penny.

1853
01:38:07,688 --> 01:38:14,688
And then, you know, went up to 1300, down to 266, up to 20,000, down to 3000.

1854
01:38:14,688 --> 01:38:18,688
And at some point, we're likely going to go 60,000.

1855
01:38:18,688 --> 01:38:22,688
And then everyone's going to get to do their 85% drop again.

1856
01:38:22,688 --> 01:38:26,688
So we need more pools of new money that hasn't been wrecked yet.

1857
01:38:26,688 --> 01:38:28,688
If you want to keep seeing price appreciation.

1858
01:38:30,688 --> 01:38:32,688
Because the only thing, once you've already bought, you're useless.

1859
01:38:32,688 --> 01:38:34,688
You can't move the price up anymore.

1860
01:38:34,688 --> 01:38:35,688
You're fucked.

1861
01:38:35,688 --> 01:38:36,688
You can't press the green button anymore.

1862
01:38:36,688 --> 01:38:37,688
You're tapped out.

1863
01:38:37,688 --> 01:38:38,688
So people have already bought.

1864
01:38:38,688 --> 01:38:42,688
They're actually bad for the price because they can only push it down with selling.

1865
01:38:42,688 --> 01:38:44,688
They can't push it up anymore.

1866
01:38:44,688 --> 01:38:47,688
If they do push it up with leverage, it's very sensitive to the margin call.

1867
01:38:47,688 --> 01:38:49,688
And then it overshoots the price down again.

1868
01:38:49,688 --> 01:38:53,688
Like you saw at the 6K horizontal that we held about a year and a half ago.

1869
01:38:53,688 --> 01:38:56,688
And when it punched through, we dropped 55%.

1870
01:38:56,688 --> 01:38:57,688
It was like 67.50.

1871
01:38:57,688 --> 01:39:00,688
We dropped a 3K on it, or 31.50.

1872
01:39:02,688 --> 01:39:05,688
Yeah, so you have a lot of intriguing views.

1873
01:39:05,688 --> 01:39:12,688
I think one weird thing that I don't think you've addressed yet is that for people
to invest in HEX,

1874
01:39:12,688 --> 01:39:18,688
you've designed HEX so that it doesn't contribute to Ethereum mining, as you made
clear.

1875
01:39:18,688 --> 01:39:22,688
It pays the fees that they desire, and they can set their rates at whatever they
choose.

1876
01:39:22,688 --> 01:39:28,688
They just choose to work for nearly nothing, which makes a better, more efficient
network if you want to do computation.

1877
01:39:28,688 --> 01:39:33,688
If you want to actually have computation going on on your Turing-complete system,

1878
01:39:33,688 --> 01:39:36,688
it's pretty nice to have it not cost an arm and a leg.

1879
01:39:36,688 --> 01:39:37,688
Oh, well, yeah.

1880
01:39:37,688 --> 01:39:41,688
Well, obviously, that's a neat trick if you can get away with it, right?

1881
01:39:41,688 --> 01:39:45,688
Because you want it all to be cheap, but you also want everything to work.

1882
01:39:46,688 --> 01:39:53,688
Yes, at some point, if Ethereum was not getting enough traction through other
projects that were paying mining rewards,

1883
01:39:53,688 --> 01:39:56,688
through block inflation like Ethereum itself is,

1884
01:39:56,758 --> 01:39:59,758
then someone else would have to pay the miners a real living wage.

1885
01:39:59,758 --> 01:40:05,758
And then we would need to have those other EIPs to rolled in to pay in the years or
20s, which is fine for me.

1886
01:40:05,758 --> 01:40:10,758
I only care about having a network which provides me censorship resistance and
rollback protection.

1887
01:40:10,758 --> 01:40:15,758
And as long as I have that, I want it for as cheap as I can get it. And I believe
most in security.

1888
01:40:15,758 --> 01:40:22,758
But when people invest, and they're going to invest for a long time, they're going
to lock up this money for 5,555 days.

1889
01:40:22,758 --> 01:40:23,758
Sure.

1890
01:40:23,758 --> 01:40:24,758
Or whatever.

1891
01:40:24,758 --> 01:40:25,758
Yep.

1892
01:40:25,758 --> 01:40:34,758
You know, they are not just buying into HEX, they're buying into the whole Ethereum
scheme, which as you...

1893
01:40:34,758 --> 01:40:40,758
So in 10 years, that guy's going to need to perform one transaction, and absolutely
nothing has to happen between now and then.

1894
01:40:40,758 --> 01:40:51,758
Yeah, but that's not really what I meant. What I meant is that, as you know, it's
very much a wet concrete situation in Ethereum.

1895
01:40:51,758 --> 01:40:52,758
Here's how good Ethereum is.

1896
01:40:52,758 --> 01:40:57,758
Five of the top 11 cryptocurrencies launched on or primarily use Ethereum.

1897
01:40:57,758 --> 01:41:04,758
BNB, TRX, USDT, Ethereum itself, and EOS.

1898
01:41:04,758 --> 01:41:11,758
Five of the top 11 valued cryptocurrencies in the world launched on or primarily use
Ethereum.

1899
01:41:11,758 --> 01:41:14,758
I believe it is a better network than Bitcoin.

1900
01:41:14,758 --> 01:41:21,758
There will be fundamental changes to Ethereum that disrupt all those projects.

1901
01:41:21,758 --> 01:41:23,758
Sure, and then you'll have two coins.

1902
01:41:23,758 --> 01:41:28,758
Sure, let's say it goes wrong. Okay, now you've got two coins, and then you add them
up and the market cap's usually higher.

1903
01:41:28,758 --> 01:41:31,758
So everyone wins, usually.

1904
01:41:31,758 --> 01:41:33,758
I didn't understand.

1905
01:41:33,758 --> 01:41:38,758
If you have a fork, if something fucks up, let's say something fucks up in Ethereum.

1906
01:41:38,758 --> 01:41:39,758
Yeah, I am.

1907
01:41:39,758 --> 01:41:40,758
They fuck up their forks.

1908
01:41:40,758 --> 01:41:41,758
These are all just hard forks.

1909
01:41:42,758 --> 01:41:43,758
Okay, so now you've got two coins.

1910
01:41:43,758 --> 01:41:45,758
You've got Ethereum Classic and you've got Ethereum Normal.

1911
01:41:45,758 --> 01:41:46,758
You've got coins on both.

1912
01:41:46,758 --> 01:41:52,758
Yeah, well, I think I actually, I kind of, as I said, I agree with Dan Kravitz about
that.

1913
01:41:52,758 --> 01:41:58,758
But actually, I think that the hard fork doesn't do enough because I'm such this big
network effect guy.

1914
01:41:58,758 --> 01:42:00,758
I don't think it's a fair fight.

1915
01:42:00,758 --> 01:42:03,758
And unfortunately, the status quo.

1916
01:42:03,758 --> 01:42:05,758
I think it's a parade of imagined horrors.

1917
01:42:05,758 --> 01:42:07,758
It's not going to happen.

1918
01:42:08,758 --> 01:42:10,758
So the new competitor.

1919
01:42:10,758 --> 01:42:22,758
So this is a problem because a truly good idea, subversive good idea, may not be
able to win with only the hard fork as its weapon.

1920
01:42:22,758 --> 01:42:24,758
So I think the hard fork doesn't do enough.

1921
01:42:24,758 --> 01:42:26,758
Let's say Ethereum fails entirely.

1922
01:42:26,758 --> 01:42:29,758
Okay, how many other blockchains support solidity?

1923
01:42:29,758 --> 01:42:30,758
Shit loads.

1924
01:42:30,758 --> 01:42:33,758
Okay, we take system state, we airdrop it to the new blockchain.

1925
01:42:33,758 --> 01:42:35,758
Okay, done.

1926
01:42:35,758 --> 01:42:41,758
Yeah, it's funny that this type of thing is possible and it already has been done
many times.

1927
01:42:41,758 --> 01:42:43,758
Yep.

1928
01:42:43,758 --> 01:42:45,758
I'm riding on the backs of giants here.

1929
01:42:45,758 --> 01:42:48,758
I mean, Bitcoin itself is built on.

1930
01:42:48,758 --> 01:42:56,758
It's what I was also thinking is that you are using a lot of things that were
invented for like different, you know,

1931
01:42:56,758 --> 01:43:03,758
just came up in weird other scenarios about how to restart the state.

1932
01:43:03,758 --> 01:43:10,758
Stuff that like Monero does and stuff that happened to the Dow ETH thing.

1933
01:43:10,758 --> 01:43:11,758
It's very funny.

1934
01:43:11,758 --> 01:43:13,758
You've assembled a very intriguing.

1935
01:43:13,758 --> 01:43:21,758
I certainly, I have to say, I can't, I really can't endorse it because, again, I am
so hung up on this whole selling a dream.

1936
01:43:21,758 --> 01:43:24,758
You know, your main value proposition is number go up.

1937
01:43:25,758 --> 01:43:29,758
So if you get something for free, you think you're going to lose money on it?

1938
01:43:29,758 --> 01:43:37,758
No, I think it's, I'm not saying that, you know what I would advise anyone listening
is I would say claim it as long as you can do so.

1939
01:43:37,758 --> 01:43:40,758
Keeping your private keys and everything very safe.

1940
01:43:40,758 --> 01:43:41,758
Very safe.

1941
01:43:41,758 --> 01:43:42,758
We use a signature.

1942
01:43:42,758 --> 01:43:44,758
You never upload your keys anyway.

1943
01:43:44,758 --> 01:43:54,758
Any two, one or two people talking on YouTube with that premise, you should check
very carefully to make sure that your private key never leaves your air gaps
computer or whatever.

1944
01:43:54,758 --> 01:43:56,758
I agree.

1945
01:43:56,758 --> 01:43:57,758
I think you should claim.

1946
01:43:57,758 --> 01:44:05,758
And then I think, you know, you should just sell a little bit of immediately, but
not all of it and have fun.

1947
01:44:05,758 --> 01:44:08,758
And, you know, I agree with you a hundred percent.

1948
01:44:08,758 --> 01:44:09,758
Yeah.

1949
01:44:09,758 --> 01:44:14,758
So it doesn't, it doesn't, you know, you build a lot of moving pieces here.

1950
01:44:14,758 --> 01:44:16,758
Well, here's the funny part.

1951
01:44:16,758 --> 01:44:18,758
After the first year, most of the shit goes away.

1952
01:44:18,758 --> 01:44:21,758
After the first year, this is the simplest fucking thing in the world.

1953
01:44:21,758 --> 01:44:22,758
It's literally.

1954
01:44:22,758 --> 01:44:29,758
This entire thing is like a Hail Mary pass on recognizability and like buy in for
like the first year.

1955
01:44:29,758 --> 01:44:31,758
It's already working.

1956
01:44:31,758 --> 01:44:32,758
It's not really Hail Mary.

1957
01:44:32,758 --> 01:44:34,758
No, I think it's very funny.

1958
01:44:34,758 --> 01:44:36,758
I mean, well, I didn't get to state the second thing.

1959
01:44:36,758 --> 01:44:43,758
I was talking about how you, one reason why I wanted to do this conversation is
because you are doing that.

1960
01:44:43,758 --> 01:44:49,758
You're kind of, you are kind of like holding up a mirror to the BTC as number go up.

1961
01:44:49,758 --> 01:44:50,758
Yeah.

1962
01:44:50,758 --> 01:44:52,758
That's all it is.

1963
01:44:52,758 --> 01:44:54,758
Which I find to be extremely funny.

1964
01:44:54,758 --> 01:44:57,758
But lately number go down.

1965
01:44:57,758 --> 01:45:00,758
Which is a neat concept.

1966
01:45:00,758 --> 01:45:09,758
But of course, the second thing is that culture has evolved a massive amount of
closed mindedness, a lot of which was originally.

1967
01:45:09,758 --> 01:45:16,758
So as I want to say, a lot of it was, it makes sense if you were in this space for a
really long time, of course, and you saw Litecoin.

1968
01:45:16,758 --> 01:45:24,758
It's, you know, it's very insulting for somebody to just copy and paste what Satoshi
must have spent so much time.

1969
01:45:24,758 --> 01:45:27,758
He chose the MIT license so he can suck a dick.

1970
01:45:27,758 --> 01:45:28,758
He could have chosen a different license.

1971
01:45:28,758 --> 01:45:30,758
I agree.

1972
01:45:30,758 --> 01:45:34,758
I'm not saying that it's, you know, violates any laws or licenses.

1973
01:45:34,758 --> 01:45:38,758
I'm just saying that it is insulting, I think, in my opinion.

1974
01:45:38,758 --> 01:45:40,758
I think every fair minded person has.

1975
01:45:40,758 --> 01:45:43,758
So you see Bitcoin people have been in the audience.

1976
01:45:43,758 --> 01:45:45,758
They've seen so many just terrible projects.

1977
01:45:45,758 --> 01:45:50,758
So, of course, everything is a scam for like the first years and years.

1978
01:45:50,758 --> 01:45:53,758
And then new people show up and they just absorb this part of the culture.

1979
01:45:53,758 --> 01:45:58,758
They just think that, oh, a new thing shows up, you call it a scam.

1980
01:45:58,758 --> 01:46:01,758
You haven't been called a scamming piece of shit yet.

1981
01:46:01,758 --> 01:46:03,758
You're pushing back against that.

1982
01:46:03,758 --> 01:46:05,758
And I don't know if you are.

1983
01:46:05,758 --> 01:46:14,758
I don't know if that's a good or bad thing or if you are the right person to be
pushing back against it.

1984
01:46:14,758 --> 01:46:27,758
But nonetheless, it is weird that we are living through this time where it is dialed
up so much that it's almost, you know, what I say it, I mean, Bitcoin is calling
everything a scam.

1985
01:46:27,758 --> 01:46:29,758
Well, there's nothing else for them to talk about.

1986
01:46:29,758 --> 01:46:33,758
There must be some kind of reaction to it at some point.

1987
01:46:33,758 --> 01:46:35,758
And so I want to explore that.

1988
01:46:35,758 --> 01:46:36,758
Sure.

1989
01:46:36,758 --> 01:46:39,758
There's nothing else for them to talk about because there's nothing going on in
Bitcoin.

1990
01:46:39,758 --> 01:46:40,758
It's boring.

1991
01:46:40,758 --> 01:46:41,758
There's nothing going on.

1992
01:46:42,758 --> 01:46:51,758
It's become self-referential and it is just about what other people have said and
not much about the external physical world.

1993
01:46:51,758 --> 01:46:52,758
They're not doing their own measurements.

1994
01:46:52,758 --> 01:46:56,758
There's been this big mission about taking money away from banks.

1995
01:46:56,758 --> 01:46:58,758
Let me sell your idea for you.

1996
01:46:58,758 --> 01:47:01,758
When was the last time Bitcoiners even said anything about that mission?

1997
01:47:01,758 --> 01:47:05,758
I can't even remember the last time someone said something about it.

1998
01:47:05,758 --> 01:47:09,758
I have a chart of narratives that came and went over time for both Bitcoin and
Ethereum.

1999
01:47:09,758 --> 01:47:11,758
Ideas come and then they disappear.

2000
01:47:11,758 --> 01:47:14,758
So, like, Ethereum, world computer.

2001
01:47:14,758 --> 01:47:15,758
Eh, not really.

2002
01:47:15,758 --> 01:47:18,758
Okay, DAOs, distributed companies.

2003
01:47:18,758 --> 01:47:19,758
No, fuck that one.

2004
01:47:19,758 --> 01:47:22,758
And then, oh, DeFi now.

2005
01:47:22,758 --> 01:47:23,758
Maybe that one works, right?

2006
01:47:23,758 --> 01:47:24,758
Bitcoin.

2007
01:47:24,758 --> 01:47:25,758
Programmable money.

2008
01:47:25,758 --> 01:47:26,758
Lol.

2009
01:47:26,758 --> 01:47:27,758
Nope.

2010
01:47:27,758 --> 01:47:29,758
Okay, peer-to-peer digital currency.

2011
01:47:29,758 --> 01:47:30,758
Nope.

2012
01:47:30,758 --> 01:47:31,758
Digital gold.

2013
01:47:31,758 --> 01:47:33,758
All right, that one seems all right.

2014
01:47:33,758 --> 01:47:36,758
And so they just keep these narratives come and go.

2015
01:47:36,758 --> 01:47:39,758
Now, as far as what you're saying about the scam shit,

2016
01:47:39,758 --> 01:47:44,758
when everything is a scam, assuming everything is a scam is great.

2017
01:47:44,758 --> 01:47:48,758
And now that 99% of things are scam, great.

2018
01:47:48,758 --> 01:47:50,758
Assuming things are scam is great.

2019
01:47:50,758 --> 01:47:52,758
Here's the problem.

2020
01:47:52,758 --> 01:47:57,758
That 1% that's not a scam will take over and pass you up and eat your fucking lunch.

2021
01:47:57,758 --> 01:48:00,758
And then you'll wonder why you're not number one market cap anymore.

2022
01:48:00,758 --> 01:48:01,758
You'll wonder how the fuck that happened.

2023
01:48:01,758 --> 01:48:02,758
Where did that come from?

2024
01:48:02,758 --> 01:48:04,758
Nokia used to be all the cell phones.

2025
01:48:04,758 --> 01:48:06,758
Now they're none of the cell phones.

2026
01:48:06,758 --> 01:48:08,758
Motorola used to be all the fucking cell phones in the States.

2027
01:48:08,758 --> 01:48:10,758
Now they're none of the cell phones.

2028
01:48:10,758 --> 01:48:12,758
IBM used to make all the laptops.

2029
01:48:12,758 --> 01:48:14,758
Now they make none of the fucking laptops.

2030
01:48:14,758 --> 01:48:16,758
Well, how did that shit happen?

2031
01:48:16,758 --> 01:48:18,758
Well, everything's a fucking scam.

2032
01:48:18,758 --> 01:48:19,758
We're the best.

2033
01:48:19,758 --> 01:48:20,758
We're the best.

2034
01:48:20,758 --> 01:48:21,758
Everything's a scam.

2035
01:48:21,758 --> 01:48:22,758
We're the best.

2036
01:48:22,758 --> 01:48:23,758
Blah, blah, blah.

2037
01:48:23,758 --> 01:48:24,758
I totally agree that network effects certainly isn't everything.

2038
01:48:24,758 --> 01:48:25,758
If that were the case,

2039
01:48:25,758 --> 01:48:28,758
BTC would never have been able to make any dent at all in the U.S. dollar,

2040
01:48:28,758 --> 01:48:32,758
and the U.S. dollar would just be humiliating to talk about Bitcoin,

2041
01:48:32,758 --> 01:48:35,758
which it sort of was very early on.

2042
01:48:35,758 --> 01:48:37,758
Anyone remembers those days,

2043
01:48:37,758 --> 01:48:41,758
these olden days where it was just humiliating to even talk about it,

2044
01:48:41,758 --> 01:48:44,758
talk about Bitcoin at all because it just seemed so crazy?

2045
01:48:44,758 --> 01:48:49,758
So if you keep your head in the stand and you do what's easy,

2046
01:48:49,758 --> 01:48:53,758
and you don't have to read all these fucking white papers because there's so many,

2047
01:48:53,758 --> 01:48:55,758
have fun with that and it feels good,

2048
01:48:55,758 --> 01:48:57,758
and I hope your number go up,

2049
01:48:57,758 --> 01:48:59,758
but eventually something better will come,

2050
01:48:59,758 --> 01:49:00,758
and it will eat your lunch,

2051
01:49:00,758 --> 01:49:01,758
and you won't be number one market cap anymore.

2052
01:49:01,758 --> 01:49:02,758
And to tell you the truth,

2053
01:49:02,758 --> 01:49:08,758
if you're happy with having only 2.8 million wallets with over $1,000 in them,

2054
01:49:08,758 --> 01:49:09,758
you're a loser.

2055
01:49:09,758 --> 01:49:11,758
This is not a successful tech project.

2056
01:49:11,758 --> 01:49:16,758
It's amazing that it could have such a high market cap with no fucking adoption
anywhere.

2057
01:49:16,758 --> 01:49:19,758
People don't understand what real adoption looks like.

2058
01:49:19,758 --> 01:49:21,758
You're buying into it in a way, though,

2059
01:49:21,758 --> 01:49:22,758
because you're saying,

2060
01:49:22,758 --> 01:49:23,758
look, I'm giving,

2061
01:49:23,758 --> 01:49:24,758
well, you gave.

2062
01:49:24,758 --> 01:49:25,758
It happened in the past.

2063
01:49:25,758 --> 01:49:26,758
It happened on December 1st.

2064
01:49:26,758 --> 01:49:31,758
But you're saying the project,

2065
01:49:31,758 --> 01:49:35,758
you're saying set aside the software release,

2066
01:49:35,758 --> 01:49:38,758
but this UTXO set that it produced,

2067
01:49:38,758 --> 01:49:45,758
this community is so valuable that they are going to be the seed in which I plant my
new thing.

2068
01:49:45,758 --> 01:49:47,758
So that's kind of a neat thing.

2069
01:49:47,758 --> 01:49:49,758
It shouldn't be that amazing.

2070
01:49:49,758 --> 01:49:50,758
You know what I mean?

2071
01:49:51,758 --> 01:49:56,758
The market cap for Bitcoin could be so high is that if you have it,

2072
01:49:56,758 --> 01:49:59,758
you're on the road for all of these hard forks of which I would say,

2073
01:49:59,758 --> 01:50:01,758
I would say hex is a hard fork.

2074
01:50:01,758 --> 01:50:02,758
It's a very weird one.

2075
01:50:02,758 --> 01:50:05,758
But I would say it is a hard fork of Bitcoin.

2076
01:50:05,758 --> 01:50:08,758
In general, I support experimentation through hard forks.

2077
01:50:08,758 --> 01:50:10,758
I really think that they,

2078
01:50:10,758 --> 01:50:14,758
it is unfortunately a hobbled experiment,

2079
01:50:14,758 --> 01:50:17,758
and it's not a true experiment that sidechains would provide,

2080
01:50:17,758 --> 01:50:19,758
for example.

2081
01:50:20,758 --> 01:50:22,758
But yeah, I think that...

2082
01:50:22,758 --> 01:50:24,758
You know if you're ever successful with your sidechain thing,

2083
01:50:24,758 --> 01:50:27,758
you're going to get called a fucking scammer every day forever.

2084
01:50:27,758 --> 01:50:29,758
Just so you know.

2085
01:50:29,758 --> 01:50:30,758
Yeah, well...

2086
01:50:30,758 --> 01:50:31,758
Give you the heads up.

2087
01:50:31,758 --> 01:50:35,758
It doesn't remain to be seen exactly how that will play out.

2088
01:50:35,758 --> 01:50:36,758
Oh, I know.

2089
01:50:36,758 --> 01:50:39,758
Because as we've discussed,

2090
01:50:39,758 --> 01:50:46,758
there has been a lot of sort of pointless controversy over it when it is totally
opt-in

2091
01:50:46,758 --> 01:50:50,758
and deployed completely by some fork and all these other things.

2092
01:50:50,758 --> 01:50:56,758
So that is kind of a weird thing for people to be upset about.

2093
01:50:56,758 --> 01:51:01,758
And it seems to me that what people are really upset about is

2094
01:51:01,758 --> 01:51:04,758
other developers getting their way.

2095
01:51:04,758 --> 01:51:06,758
And that...

2096
01:51:06,758 --> 01:51:10,758
Well, first of all, most, as you say, 99% of things are just terrible.

2097
01:51:10,758 --> 01:51:14,758
And so people often, they say, what would I use a sidechain for?

2098
01:51:15,758 --> 01:51:19,758
With some justification, because almost all of them do suck.

2099
01:51:19,758 --> 01:51:22,758
But yeah, really, it's a kind of disloyalty to the Bitcoin Core developers

2100
01:51:22,758 --> 01:51:24,758
that I think is really what comes up.

2101
01:51:24,758 --> 01:51:28,758
Could I say that, in fact, actually most of these things don't suck?

2102
01:51:28,758 --> 01:51:31,758
So for instance, everyone makes fun of XRP.

2103
01:51:31,758 --> 01:51:32,758
I make fun of XRP.

2104
01:51:32,758 --> 01:51:33,758
Everyone makes fun of it.

2105
01:51:33,758 --> 01:51:36,758
This shit does actually move money from here to there instantly,

2106
01:51:36,758 --> 01:51:38,758
faster than other blockchains.

2107
01:51:38,758 --> 01:51:39,758
Okay.

2108
01:51:39,758 --> 01:51:40,758
Well, it doesn't actually suck.

2109
01:51:40,758 --> 01:51:42,758
Particularly if you're doing arbitrage

2110
01:51:42,758 --> 01:51:45,758
and you're worried about the price spread making you at a loss

2111
01:51:45,758 --> 01:51:47,758
instead of a gain.

2112
01:51:47,758 --> 01:51:48,758
Does Dogecoin suck?

2113
01:51:48,758 --> 01:51:50,758
It's worth a quarter of a billion dollars.

2114
01:51:51,758 --> 01:51:52,758
Sorry?

2115
01:51:52,758 --> 01:51:53,758
Does Dogecoin suck?

2116
01:51:53,758 --> 01:51:55,758
It's worth a quarter of a billion dollars.

2117
01:51:55,758 --> 01:51:56,758
It's a joke coin.

2118
01:51:56,758 --> 01:51:57,758
Fork of Bitcoin.

2119
01:51:57,758 --> 01:51:58,758
Works fine.

2120
01:51:58,758 --> 01:51:59,758
It is explicitly a joke.

2121
01:51:59,758 --> 01:52:00,758
And it does a very good job.

2122
01:52:00,758 --> 01:52:03,758
I mean, one thing it was doing, it was saying,

2123
01:52:03,758 --> 01:52:05,758
if your coin is worth less than this,

2124
01:52:05,758 --> 01:52:09,758
then how much of a failure are you?

2125
01:52:10,758 --> 01:52:13,758
It was explicitly satirical.

2126
01:52:15,758 --> 01:52:17,758
Saying, as if we tried.

2127
01:52:17,758 --> 01:52:19,758
As if we tried to come up with a logo.

2128
01:52:19,758 --> 01:52:22,758
It's just a Shiba Inu.

2129
01:52:24,758 --> 01:52:25,758
Bro.

2130
01:52:25,758 --> 01:52:28,758
People ask me, they're like, why would anyone buy Hex?

2131
01:52:28,758 --> 01:52:30,758
I'm like, listen, lots of good reasons,

2132
01:52:30,758 --> 01:52:32,758
but even if we didn't have any good reasons,

2133
01:52:32,758 --> 01:52:34,758
Dogecoin is worth a quarter of a billion dollars.

2134
01:52:34,758 --> 01:52:35,758
Shut the fuck up.

2135
01:52:35,758 --> 01:52:36,758
It's like.

2136
01:52:37,758 --> 01:52:38,758
Yeah.

2137
01:52:38,758 --> 01:52:39,758
Like.

2138
01:52:39,758 --> 01:52:42,758
You know, being worth more partially validates,

2139
01:52:42,758 --> 01:52:43,758
but not completely.

2140
01:52:43,758 --> 01:52:46,758
The project is, you know.

2141
01:52:46,758 --> 01:52:48,758
Well, I'm not saying.

2142
01:52:48,758 --> 01:52:52,758
If a person, so who has, in crypto, really,

2143
01:52:52,758 --> 01:52:55,758
who has the onus of responsibility?

2144
01:52:55,758 --> 01:52:57,758
The person that says the price will go up,

2145
01:52:57,758 --> 01:52:59,758
or the person that says price will go down?

2146
01:52:59,758 --> 01:53:01,758
Because what I see is a top 100 market cap

2147
01:53:01,758 --> 01:53:04,758
full of fucking jokes that are worth shit loads

2148
01:53:04,758 --> 01:53:06,758
that have no adoption whatsoever.

2149
01:53:06,758 --> 01:53:07,758
That's what I see.

2150
01:53:07,758 --> 01:53:09,758
And so if a joke.

2151
01:53:09,758 --> 01:53:10,758
It's symmetric.

2152
01:53:10,758 --> 01:53:14,758
I think anyone making any claim about the price is.

2153
01:53:14,758 --> 01:53:17,758
The good, you know, they have to justify that somehow.

2154
01:53:17,758 --> 01:53:19,758
As long as Dogecoin is worth a quarter of a billion dollars,

2155
01:53:19,758 --> 01:53:24,758
it's very hard for me to say that any project won't go up in price.

2156
01:53:24,758 --> 01:53:27,758
Truthfully.

2157
01:53:27,758 --> 01:53:30,758
Yeah, but you know, Dogecoin.

2158
01:53:30,758 --> 01:53:31,758
That it hasn't.

2159
01:53:31,758 --> 01:53:33,758
It's not as you yourself said.

2160
01:53:33,758 --> 01:53:36,758
It's not that Dogecoin has just gone up and up and up and up forever.

2161
01:53:36,758 --> 01:53:37,758
No, everything goes up and down.

2162
01:53:37,758 --> 01:53:38,758
Everything.

2163
01:53:38,758 --> 01:53:40,758
You can't even get out of that.

2164
01:53:40,758 --> 01:53:41,758
Everything goes up and down.

2165
01:53:41,758 --> 01:53:44,758
Just some things don't go back up.

2166
01:53:44,758 --> 01:53:46,758
Sure.

2167
01:53:46,758 --> 01:53:48,758
What was the point of saying it was worth 250 million?

2168
01:53:48,758 --> 01:53:49,758
Or whatever.

2169
01:53:49,758 --> 01:53:52,758
That people ask you.

2170
01:53:52,758 --> 01:53:55,758
So your brain, I can feel it.

2171
01:53:55,758 --> 01:53:56,758
I can feel it.

2172
01:53:56,758 --> 01:54:00,758
Your brain wants to believe that there has to be some interesting

2173
01:54:00,758 --> 01:54:03,758
or good reason for people to buy a thing.

2174
01:54:03,758 --> 01:54:05,758
And I'm telling you it's not the case.

2175
01:54:05,758 --> 01:54:07,758
There is some reason.

2176
01:54:07,758 --> 01:54:09,758
Something caused them to.

2177
01:54:09,758 --> 01:54:11,758
The hype is worth more than the technology.

2178
01:54:11,758 --> 01:54:12,758
Every time.

2179
01:54:12,758 --> 01:54:14,758
Every time.

2180
01:54:14,758 --> 01:54:15,758
And it will always be that way.

2181
01:54:15,758 --> 01:54:16,758
I don't know.

2182
01:54:16,758 --> 01:54:18,758
Because that doesn't actually help you succeed, though.

2183
01:54:18,758 --> 01:54:22,758
Because then you have to be the best hype guy.

2184
01:54:22,758 --> 01:54:23,758
I'm pretty good.

2185
01:54:23,758 --> 01:54:24,758
I don't know.

2186
01:54:24,758 --> 01:54:27,758
You know, then you've got to be the best hype guy forever.

2187
01:54:27,758 --> 01:54:28,758
No.

2188
01:54:28,758 --> 01:54:31,758
You just have to build an ecosystem that rewards other people for making

2189
01:54:31,758 --> 01:54:32,758
hype.

2190
01:54:32,758 --> 01:54:35,758
Someone could maybe develop a.

2191
01:54:35,758 --> 01:54:38,758
Mark Zuckerberg could steal the hex strategy.

2192
01:54:38,758 --> 01:54:39,758
You could have.

2193
01:54:39,758 --> 01:54:40,758
It would be unlikely.

2194
01:54:40,758 --> 01:54:41,758
10%.

2195
01:54:41,758 --> 01:54:42,758
You could have.

2196
01:54:42,758 --> 01:54:43,758
Someone could have 12% if you have a referral.

2197
01:54:43,758 --> 01:54:44,758
Instead of 10%.

2198
01:54:44,758 --> 01:54:45,758
He would be the first.

2199
01:54:45,758 --> 01:54:49,758
He would be the first fork to outperform the original.

2200
01:54:49,758 --> 01:54:50,758
So Ethereum.

2201
01:54:50,758 --> 01:54:52,758
Ethereum has a theorem classic.

2202
01:54:52,758 --> 01:54:53,758
It's worth like what?

2203
01:54:53,758 --> 01:54:54,758
Three or percent, 2%.

2204
01:54:54,758 --> 01:54:55,758
Something like that.

2205
01:54:55,758 --> 01:54:57,758
It was a fork that outperformed the original.

2206
01:54:57,758 --> 01:54:58,758
Yes?

2207
01:54:58,758 --> 01:54:59,758
No.

2208
01:54:59,758 --> 01:55:00,758
Ethereum is worth more than Ethereum classic.

2209
01:55:00,758 --> 01:55:01,758
Oh, you're talking about.

2210
01:55:01,758 --> 01:55:02,758
Okay.

2211
01:55:02,758 --> 01:55:03,758
Ethereum is the fork.

2212
01:55:03,758 --> 01:55:04,758
Yeah, yeah.

2213
01:55:04,758 --> 01:55:05,758
Okay.

2214
01:55:05,758 --> 01:55:06,758
Yes.

2215
01:55:06,758 --> 01:55:07,758
So Ethereum is the fork.

2216
01:55:07,758 --> 01:55:09,758
Ethereum classic is the real original thing.

2217
01:55:09,758 --> 01:55:13,758
And the real original thing is worth about 2% or 3% of the fork.

2218
01:55:13,758 --> 01:55:16,758
Forks in general do not do well.

2219
01:55:16,758 --> 01:55:19,758
But they could have other advantages that make up for that disadvantage.

2220
01:55:19,758 --> 01:55:20,758
I agree.

2221
01:55:20,758 --> 01:55:21,758
That's what I was just saying.

2222
01:55:21,758 --> 01:55:22,758
That the hard fork.

2223
01:55:22,758 --> 01:55:23,758
Oh.

2224
01:55:23,758 --> 01:55:24,758
Oh.

2225
01:55:25,758 --> 01:55:26,758
All right.

2226
01:55:26,758 --> 01:55:27,758
Let's hear it.

2227
01:55:27,758 --> 01:55:30,758
People buy crypto because they want the price to go up.

2228
01:55:30,758 --> 01:55:31,758
That's my thesis.

2229
01:55:31,758 --> 01:55:32,758
I think that's true.

2230
01:55:32,758 --> 01:55:34,758
But you understand that that is not.

2231
01:55:34,758 --> 01:55:39,758
That's very difficult for you to channel that greed into one specific project.

2232
01:55:39,758 --> 01:55:40,758
Apparently not, bro.

2233
01:55:40,758 --> 01:55:46,758
Like X has already got $6 million of Ethereum transformed into hex on the first two
weeks.

2234
01:55:46,758 --> 01:55:49,758
So apparently it's going okay.

2235
01:55:49,758 --> 01:55:50,758
With not a zero.

2236
01:55:50,758 --> 01:55:53,758
Not a single dollar spent on marketing.

2237
01:55:54,758 --> 01:55:56,758
Opportunity cost of your time and other things.

2238
01:55:56,758 --> 01:55:58,758
I understand what you mean.

2239
01:55:58,758 --> 01:56:00,758
I don't know.

2240
01:56:00,758 --> 01:56:06,758
It seems like it doesn't have any purpose other than number go up.

2241
01:56:06,758 --> 01:56:14,758
It only does everything better than Bitcoin except for liquidity, retail adoption,
substrate for liquid.

2242
01:56:14,758 --> 01:56:20,758
It's very funny that you've narrowly zoned in on the store of value.

2243
01:56:21,758 --> 01:56:23,758
It also does cheaper transactions.

2244
01:56:23,758 --> 01:56:27,758
And it also has anonymity because of tornado cash soon.

2245
01:56:27,758 --> 01:56:28,758
Oh, yeah.

2246
01:56:28,758 --> 01:56:29,758
Sure.

2247
01:56:29,758 --> 01:56:30,758
Maybe weird.

2248
01:56:30,758 --> 01:56:31,758
If you're in technology.

2249
01:56:31,758 --> 01:56:32,758
It's not weird.

2250
01:56:32,758 --> 01:56:33,758
It's just code.

2251
01:56:33,758 --> 01:56:34,758
All this is just code, man.

2252
01:56:34,758 --> 01:56:35,758
It's not something weird about it.

2253
01:56:35,758 --> 01:56:37,758
It's just normal code.

2254
01:56:37,758 --> 01:56:39,758
There's nothing weird about it.

2255
01:56:39,758 --> 01:56:46,758
I mean, I do have to say on behalf of the technical community, I have to thank you
for producing a project.

2256
01:56:47,758 --> 01:56:52,758
Before asking for the money and bucking the horrible ICO trend, as I've already
said.

2257
01:56:52,758 --> 01:57:04,758
And as a Bitcoiner, I have to thank you for honoring in some way the UTXO set, even
though you didn't totally honor the 1,000 BTC and up.

2258
01:57:04,758 --> 01:57:06,758
But 140K in GOX, they can't claim.

2259
01:57:06,758 --> 01:57:07,758
139K.

2260
01:57:07,758 --> 01:57:08,758
Brethren.

2261
01:57:08,758 --> 01:57:13,758
But anyway, I do support hard forks.

2262
01:57:13,758 --> 01:57:15,758
People giving me money for free.

2263
01:57:15,758 --> 01:57:16,758
I support that.

2264
01:57:16,758 --> 01:57:18,758
And other Bitcoiners should as well.

2265
01:57:18,758 --> 01:57:19,758
You're welcome.

2266
01:57:19,758 --> 01:57:23,758
The hatred for the hard forks, I think, is irrational.

2267
01:57:23,758 --> 01:57:25,758
I don't understand it at all.

2268
01:57:25,758 --> 01:57:26,758
I agree.

2269
01:57:26,758 --> 01:57:29,758
You know what I love talking about, talking with you?

2270
01:57:29,758 --> 01:57:34,758
I can tell that you're thinking on the fly and truly putting diligence into the
ideas.

2271
01:57:34,758 --> 01:57:36,758
And you're not repeating canned talking points.

2272
01:57:36,758 --> 01:57:41,758
You know what's true is that I did not do any preparation for this at all.

2273
01:57:41,758 --> 01:57:43,758
So thinking on the fly is all I've got.

2274
01:57:43,758 --> 01:57:44,758
That's all I've got.

2275
01:57:44,758 --> 01:57:45,758
It's better.

2276
01:57:45,758 --> 01:57:46,758
It's better for the audience.

2277
01:57:46,758 --> 01:57:47,758
They can learn at the same time.

2278
01:57:50,758 --> 01:57:51,758
So there you go, buddy.

2279
01:57:51,758 --> 01:57:53,758
It's very funny.

2280
01:57:53,758 --> 01:57:55,758
I don't know.

2281
01:57:55,758 --> 01:57:57,758
It's people's definition of a scam.

2282
01:57:57,758 --> 01:58:00,758
That word has morphed.

2283
01:58:00,758 --> 01:58:02,758
And at this point, it's a kind of—

2284
01:58:02,758 --> 01:58:04,758
It just means not Bitcoin.

2285
01:58:04,758 --> 01:58:05,758
That's all it means now.

2286
01:58:05,758 --> 01:58:09,758
But there's a kind of shame or a kind of treadmill.

2287
01:58:10,758 --> 01:58:15,758
What was that phrase that Steven Pinker used at some point about if you don't—

2288
01:58:19,758 --> 01:58:23,758
If your standards are lax, there's a bias.

2289
01:58:23,758 --> 01:58:29,758
If I fail to point out a scam, then I'm complicit and I've harmed everyone.

2290
01:58:29,758 --> 01:58:36,758
It's kind of like all the world needs to do to be damned is to have good men.

2291
01:58:36,758 --> 01:58:41,758
So I need to lean into skepticism, which everyone should.

2292
01:58:41,758 --> 01:58:42,758
Yeah.

2293
01:58:42,758 --> 01:58:43,758
Look, I support that.

2294
01:58:43,758 --> 01:58:44,758
Don't listen to anything I've said.

2295
01:58:44,758 --> 01:58:45,758
Go read the code.

2296
01:58:45,758 --> 01:58:47,758
It's literally on etherscam.io.

2297
01:58:47,758 --> 01:58:49,758
So you go to hex.win.

2298
01:58:49,758 --> 01:58:53,758
Right up at the top, it says here's the contract address.

2299
01:58:53,758 --> 01:58:55,758
Copy that into etherscam.io.

2300
01:58:55,758 --> 01:58:58,758
Hit Enter and then click Code.

2301
01:58:58,758 --> 01:59:02,758
And then it will show you the verified code of the contract.

2302
01:59:02,758 --> 01:59:04,758
And that's what's being run.

2303
01:59:04,758 --> 01:59:05,758
That type of stuff is—

2304
01:59:05,758 --> 01:59:07,758
Well, I have a question about the—

2305
01:59:07,758 --> 01:59:09,758
So is there some kind of timeline for redeem?

2306
01:59:09,758 --> 01:59:10,758
Is it a year?

2307
01:59:10,758 --> 01:59:12,758
Yeah, you bleed every week.

2308
01:59:12,758 --> 01:59:14,758
You bleed 2% until there's nothing left.

2309
01:59:14,758 --> 01:59:16,758
Oh, this is very like—

2310
01:59:16,758 --> 01:59:17,758
Yeah.

2311
01:59:17,758 --> 01:59:18,758
This is really something.

2312
01:59:18,758 --> 01:59:19,758
You're like—

2313
01:59:19,758 --> 01:59:22,758
You are like if the jigsaw serial killer—

2314
01:59:24,758 --> 01:59:26,758
Yeah, if you don't claim the first day.

2315
01:59:26,758 --> 01:59:33,758
So the first day, you get a 20% bonus and it falls to zero linearly over 350 days.

2316
01:59:33,758 --> 01:59:38,758
And you bleed out your whole stack linearly over 350 days.

2317
01:59:38,758 --> 01:59:42,758
And the people that will receive the value of what you could have claimed are the
stakers.

2318
01:59:42,758 --> 01:59:44,758
And they get paid by shares.

2319
01:59:44,758 --> 01:59:46,758
The longer they stake, the more they make.

2320
01:59:46,758 --> 01:59:52,758
So you're bleeding every day you don't claim and giving it to the people that
believe the most in the project.

2321
01:59:53,758 --> 01:59:55,758
Yeah, no, it makes sense to me.

2322
01:59:55,758 --> 02:00:00,758
I'm going to say I think this project is very unlikely to defeat BTC.

2323
02:00:00,758 --> 02:00:06,758
But I do support all creative projects and especially hard forks that honor the UTXO
set.

2324
02:00:06,758 --> 02:00:09,758
So I think now that you've—

2325
02:00:09,758 --> 02:00:10,758
Let's give it a shot.

2326
02:00:10,758 --> 02:00:12,758
And it should be fun to watch.

2327
02:00:14,758 --> 02:00:16,758
Imagine—I'll put it this way.

2328
02:00:16,758 --> 02:00:24,758
If we did beat BTC and we did it, imagine what the ROI percent would have to be in
order to pass BTC on the market cap in a short time frame.

2329
02:00:24,758 --> 02:00:29,758
The ROI percent would be millions of percent, I think.

2330
02:00:30,758 --> 02:00:32,758
Depends on where you measure it from.

2331
02:00:32,758 --> 02:00:35,758
So people jumped in really, really heavy day one.

2332
02:00:35,758 --> 02:00:39,758
Even though I showed them the EOS charts and said, look how everyone jumped in
overly heavy day one.

2333
02:00:39,758 --> 02:00:41,758
Maybe you want to average in.

2334
02:00:41,758 --> 02:00:43,758
They just—everyone jumped in day one anyway.

2335
02:00:43,758 --> 02:00:45,758
Even though the launch is 351 days.

2336
02:00:46,758 --> 02:00:48,758
They just jumped in heavy anyway.

2337
02:00:48,758 --> 02:00:58,758
So then those guys can now—the ratio that they got for HEX to the ETH that they put
in, it's now like 20 times better.

2338
02:00:58,758 --> 02:01:04,758
So the people that are putting in now are getting 20 times more than the guys that
put in the first day.

2339
02:01:04,758 --> 02:01:06,758
Because just too many people jumped in the first day.

2340
02:01:06,758 --> 02:01:10,758
Two years of anticipation was released on a single day.

2341
02:01:10,758 --> 02:01:14,758
And now we're getting a day of anticipation every day basically.

2342
02:01:14,758 --> 02:01:15,758
And you see it in the numbers.

2343
02:01:15,758 --> 02:01:16,758
Interesting.

2344
02:01:16,758 --> 02:01:22,758
Well, you know, many people have designed weird things like pyramid schemes that
have all these bells and whistles.

2345
02:01:22,758 --> 02:01:28,758
But also just any normal thing where you would sell a concert, you have the early
bird pricing and whatever.

2346
02:01:28,758 --> 02:01:33,758
All this stuff has been done before, but—

2347
02:01:33,758 --> 02:01:36,758
I don't think these things that are—

2348
02:01:36,758 --> 02:01:39,758
Yeah, you have some truly weird stuff in here.

2349
02:01:39,758 --> 02:01:41,758
I think there's some unique things here.

2350
02:01:41,758 --> 02:01:42,758
Like a lot of them.

2351
02:01:42,758 --> 02:01:46,758
Most important is, I believe, the graph of future market supply.

2352
02:01:46,758 --> 02:01:49,758
That should give us a better Sharpe ratio.

2353
02:01:49,758 --> 02:01:52,758
Because you can choose to have your stake end when someone else's isn't.

2354
02:01:52,758 --> 02:01:56,758
And then you spread out the supply shock over a wider range.

2355
02:01:56,758 --> 02:02:00,758
And you have more intelligence in the market about the future state of the system.

2356
02:02:00,758 --> 02:02:04,758
You can't directly manage the circulating supply.

2357
02:02:04,758 --> 02:02:05,758
Right.

2358
02:02:05,758 --> 02:02:07,758
That doesn't exist anywhere else.

2359
02:02:07,758 --> 02:02:10,758
There's no other cryptocurrency in the world that has that.

2360
02:02:10,758 --> 02:02:11,758
It's amazing.

2361
02:02:11,758 --> 02:02:13,758
It's really, really good.

2362
02:02:13,758 --> 02:02:15,758
Groundbreaking economics.

2363
02:02:15,758 --> 02:02:17,758
Other places, I don't know, like markets.

2364
02:02:17,758 --> 02:02:18,758
There's different markets.

2365
02:02:18,758 --> 02:02:20,758
In normal finance, I think that exists.

2366
02:02:20,758 --> 02:02:22,758
But in crypto, it doesn't.

2367
02:02:22,758 --> 02:02:23,758
Yeah.

2368
02:02:23,758 --> 02:02:24,758
Well, maybe.

2369
02:02:24,758 --> 02:02:25,758
I don't know.

2370
02:02:25,758 --> 02:02:26,758
I don't know.

2371
02:02:26,758 --> 02:02:32,758
There's a million projects in crypto, and there's no possible way I can look at any
of them.

2372
02:02:32,758 --> 02:02:34,758
But yeah, well, I don't know.

2373
02:02:34,758 --> 02:02:36,758
This has been going on for a long time.

2374
02:02:36,758 --> 02:02:38,758
This is two hours?

2375
02:02:38,758 --> 02:02:39,758
Yep.

2376
02:02:40,758 --> 02:02:41,758
So it's been fun.

2377
02:02:41,758 --> 02:02:42,758
It's been fun, bro.

2378
02:02:42,758 --> 02:02:45,758
Thank you for asking me about sidechains.

2379
02:02:45,758 --> 02:02:46,758
I did not expect that.

2380
02:02:46,758 --> 02:02:47,758
I didn't prepare for that.

2381
02:02:47,758 --> 02:02:49,758
I hope that you are able to make them successful.

2382
02:02:49,758 --> 02:02:50,758
Yeah, we'll see.

2383
02:02:50,758 --> 02:02:51,758
We will see.

2384
02:02:51,758 --> 02:02:55,758
If so, then people could do weird projects like this.

2385
02:02:55,758 --> 02:02:57,758
On an ecosystem that doesn't want them to.

2386
02:02:57,758 --> 02:02:58,758
Not only, right?

2387
02:02:58,758 --> 02:03:00,758
It would be its own piece of software.

2388
02:03:00,758 --> 02:03:07,758
And you could then not only buy in for one Bitcoin, but also change your mind and
escape

2389
02:03:07,758 --> 02:03:09,758
back to the, say, I don't like that.

2390
02:03:09,758 --> 02:03:10,758
That was a mistake.

2391
02:03:10,758 --> 02:03:14,758
Although, if someone did a project like yours, it would necessarily have to involve
all kinds

2392
02:03:14,758 --> 02:03:19,758
of weird demurrage inflation techs, like over there, happening in the sidechain with
their

2393
02:03:19,758 --> 02:03:20,758
money.

2394
02:03:20,758 --> 02:03:23,758
They would be getting a different quantity of money back somehow.

2395
02:03:23,758 --> 02:03:24,758
Yep.

2396
02:03:24,758 --> 02:03:25,758
Pretty much.

2397
02:03:25,758 --> 02:03:27,758
Things you've been doing over there, but someone could do them.

2398
02:03:27,758 --> 02:03:28,758
You've got online incentives.

2399
02:03:28,758 --> 02:03:30,758
You've got online incentives.

2400
02:03:30,758 --> 02:03:33,758
Who deserves the most of a new cryptocurrency is the question.

2401
02:03:33,758 --> 02:03:34,758
Who deserves the most?

2402
02:03:35,758 --> 02:03:38,758
Well, the people that sacrifice the most and believe the most, is my opinion.

2403
02:03:38,758 --> 02:03:40,758
So, that's what we built.

2404
02:03:42,758 --> 02:03:44,758
Oh, well, I'm not sure that that...

2405
02:03:44,758 --> 02:03:46,758
Isn't that already what would happen?

2406
02:03:46,758 --> 02:03:49,758
You would say, miners would mine, but then they're selling them at this big auction,

2407
02:03:49,758 --> 02:03:51,758
and then they go to the highest bidder.

2408
02:03:51,758 --> 02:03:56,758
They would already go to people who, even in the Bitcoin case, in 2029...

2409
02:03:56,758 --> 02:04:02,758
I don't think that rewarding Asian silicon manufacturers that won't talk to you on
Twitter

2410
02:04:02,758 --> 02:04:04,758
is that good for the world.

2411
02:04:04,758 --> 02:04:07,758
Yes, but you say they generate the coins, but they have to sell them.

2412
02:04:07,758 --> 02:04:11,758
As you yourself pointed out, Dan, to immediately sell them, they go to the highest
bidder on

2413
02:04:11,758 --> 02:04:12,758
the market.

2414
02:04:12,758 --> 02:04:18,758
And so, the market is constantly preserving allocative efficiency, as it's called.

2415
02:04:18,758 --> 02:04:21,758
People who value the coin will end up with them.

2416
02:04:21,758 --> 02:04:23,758
But you're saying who gets the inflation tax?

2417
02:04:23,758 --> 02:04:24,758
Yes.

2418
02:04:25,758 --> 02:04:29,758
Because whoever gets the money first gets the most value, because it hasn't pushed
the

2419
02:04:29,758 --> 02:04:31,758
price down yet.

2420
02:04:31,758 --> 02:04:34,758
In Satoshi's design, it's just kind of like...

2421
02:04:34,758 --> 02:04:36,758
It's not that good.

2422
02:04:36,758 --> 02:04:38,758
Satoshi's design is not that good.

2423
02:04:38,758 --> 02:04:39,758
Let me ask you this.

2424
02:04:39,758 --> 02:04:42,758
Why does the inflation rate drop only every once every four years?

2425
02:04:42,758 --> 02:04:44,758
Why not every fucking day?

2426
02:04:44,758 --> 02:04:45,758
What's up with that stupid shit?

2427
02:04:45,758 --> 02:04:47,758
Why isn't it just constant?

2428
02:04:47,758 --> 02:04:49,758
Why the fuck do we have this huge...

2429
02:04:49,758 --> 02:04:50,758
I wrote a blog post.

2430
02:04:50,758 --> 02:04:55,758
It's weird that I think Peter Todd and I are the only two people who share that
view.

2431
02:04:55,758 --> 02:04:56,758
It's stupid.

2432
02:04:56,758 --> 02:04:58,758
Me and Peter Todd, which is very funny.

2433
02:04:58,758 --> 02:05:00,666
It's kind of a mistake.

2434
02:05:00,666 --> 02:05:23,666
Even though the difficulty adjustments, jumping discreetly every two weeks, was
definitely a smart decision, as Andrew Polster has pointed out in his cool paper,
and other people, the supply shocks should probably not be a huge amount in one day.

2435
02:05:23,666 --> 02:05:24,666
That's very dumb.

2436
02:05:24,666 --> 02:05:25,666
That's a weird feature.

2437
02:05:25,666 --> 02:05:28,666
I'll leave you with a final question, because we've already done two hours.

2438
02:05:28,666 --> 02:05:33,666
Not that I care, but I know you're probably getting tired.

2439
02:05:33,666 --> 02:05:38,666
I came up with an idea that I thought was remedial and stupid, but would probably
work.

2440
02:05:38,666 --> 02:05:52,666
If people actually care about Bitcoin scaling, why don't you just make a couple
extra Bitcoins that run on a different port, and one is Bitcoin North America, and
one is Bitcoin China, and one is Bitcoin Europe,

2441
02:05:52,666 --> 02:05:59,666
and then you can atomic cross swap when you want to get across, and then you have
higher throughput by whatever number of chains that you had.

2442
02:05:59,666 --> 02:06:00,666
Indeed, yeah.

2443
02:06:00,666 --> 02:06:03,666
Sidechains could plausibly work that way.

2444
02:06:03,666 --> 02:06:07,666
There could be a few different large block payment sidechains, and it would make
sense for them to be...

2445
02:06:07,666 --> 02:06:08,666
Okay.

2446
02:06:08,666 --> 02:06:09,666
So this idea was not stupid.

2447
02:06:09,666 --> 02:06:10,666
It would work, right?

2448
02:06:11,666 --> 02:06:24,666
No, I think it would, because they would not want to do the atomic swaps, because
that's two kind of fake transactions on each one transaction, each network, but not
really to transact.

2449
02:06:24,666 --> 02:06:26,666
It's only to send money to yourself.

2450
02:06:26,666 --> 02:06:38,666
So you would want to minimize those, so you would want to do them as little as
possible, so you'd want to have them all with your trading partners, and Amazon
would be in all three and whatever it is.

2451
02:06:39,666 --> 02:06:40,666
I posted that on Twitter.

2452
02:06:40,666 --> 02:06:41,666
No one responds.

2453
02:06:41,666 --> 02:06:45,666
No one cares, because no one actually cares about scaling Bitcoin, because they only
care about the price going up.

2454
02:06:47,666 --> 02:06:52,666
Well, I don't know about that, but that is a dominant rubric for people.

2455
02:06:52,666 --> 02:06:53,666
Maybe it's just Twitter.

2456
02:06:53,666 --> 02:06:55,666
Maybe if I posted that on Bitcoin Wizards...

2457
02:06:55,666 --> 02:06:56,666
Twitter?

2458
02:06:56,666 --> 02:06:57,666
I don't know.

2459
02:06:58,666 --> 02:07:19,666
It's hard to explain exactly the role of Twitter, because as I have been mentioning,
what is in people's brains and what is in the culture is actually extremely
important, and Twitter is more in control of that than I think anyone is comfortable
with.

2460
02:07:19,666 --> 02:07:20,666
I like Twitter.

2461
02:07:21,666 --> 02:07:22,666
I like Twitter.

2462
02:07:23,666 --> 02:07:25,666
I'll take Twitter over Reddit.

2463
02:07:25,666 --> 02:07:27,666
I'm trying to say Twitter is not Bitcoin.

2464
02:07:31,666 --> 02:07:35,666
It's certainly true to a great extent, but not completely.

2465
02:07:35,666 --> 02:07:40,666
So you're going to claim your hex, and everyone else is going to go to
drivechain.info to check out your sidechain thing.

2466
02:07:40,666 --> 02:07:44,666
Yeah, I'm going to research very carefully exactly what has to happen to my private
keys.

2467
02:07:45,666 --> 02:07:47,666
Can I tell you what you do?

2468
02:07:47,666 --> 02:07:49,666
You just go to go.hex.win.

2469
02:07:49,666 --> 02:07:55,666
If you want a 10% bonus, go to pumpamentals.com, and then go to gotohex.win in the
same browser.

2470
02:07:55,666 --> 02:08:02,666
Install MetaMask, which is just an Ethereum wallet that allows you to talk to the
blockchain.

2471
02:08:03,666 --> 02:08:05,666
You put your Bitcoin address in there.

2472
02:08:05,666 --> 02:08:08,666
Now, if you want to be anonymous, you do it through a VPN.

2473
02:08:08,666 --> 02:08:11,666
Clear cookies, go through VPN.

2474
02:08:11,666 --> 02:08:12,666
Yeah, definitely.

2475
02:08:12,666 --> 02:08:15,666
VirtualBox will be involved probably a few times.

2476
02:08:15,666 --> 02:08:16,666
To go to a website.

2477
02:08:16,666 --> 02:08:19,666
You don't have to have a VirtualBox to go to a website, but if you want to, go
ahead.

2478
02:08:21,666 --> 02:08:27,666
If you're Paul Sztorc, open up virtualbox.org, install whatever OS that you want.

2479
02:08:28,666 --> 02:08:30,666
Maybe you use Tails, whatever.

2480
02:08:32,666 --> 02:08:34,666
Go to go.hex.win.

2481
02:08:34,666 --> 02:08:37,666
If you want a 10% bonus, click pumpamentals first, pumpamentals.com.

2482
02:08:38,666 --> 02:08:40,666
Put in your Bitcoin address.

2483
02:08:40,666 --> 02:08:41,666
Click claim.

2484
02:08:41,666 --> 02:08:44,666
Copy the statement out into your Bitcoin wallet.

2485
02:08:44,666 --> 02:08:49,666
Now, this statement is simply claim hex 2, your Ethereum address.

2486
02:08:49,666 --> 02:08:50,666
That's all it is.

2487
02:08:50,666 --> 02:08:51,666
It's not exciting.

2488
02:08:51,666 --> 02:08:52,666
It's not interesting.

2489
02:08:52,666 --> 02:08:53,666
You can't lose any money.

2490
02:08:53,666 --> 02:08:56,666
It's a fucking feature of your wallet because it is safe to use.

2491
02:08:56,666 --> 02:09:01,666
You copy that into your wallet in the tools, sign message.

2492
02:09:01,666 --> 02:09:04,666
I was going to ask if you use the sign message thing that's right in there.

2493
02:09:04,666 --> 02:09:05,666
Yep.

2494
02:09:05,666 --> 02:09:09,666
You paste that, and then you sign it, and you copy and paste the signature, and you
click submit.

2495
02:09:09,666 --> 02:09:13,666
As long as you've got one penny of ETH, or you can mine your own block a lot harder,

2496
02:09:13,666 --> 02:09:16,666
but as long as you've got one penny of ETH or maybe sometimes three or four pennies,

2497
02:09:16,666 --> 02:09:20,666
you will mint your hex right there, and then you're done.

2498
02:09:22,666 --> 02:09:26,666
I have this video to walk you through doing that, even importing your keys to
Electrum.

2499
02:09:26,666 --> 02:09:29,666
If you had a wallet that sucked and didn't have the sign message feature,

2500
02:09:29,666 --> 02:09:31,666
and then you had to import keys to something else.

2501
02:09:31,666 --> 02:09:33,666
If you've already got Trezor, it's native.

2502
02:09:33,666 --> 02:09:34,666
You don't have to touch anything.

2503
02:09:34,666 --> 02:09:36,666
You stay native in the device.

2504
02:09:36,666 --> 02:09:41,666
If you use Ledger, you've got to use Electrum because they deprecated the signature
function because they suck.

2505
02:09:42,666 --> 02:09:46,666
Very wise of you to use the inbuilt sign message feature.

2506
02:09:46,666 --> 02:09:51,666
If you had said stuff about open the console and start typing, then our conversation
would have changed.

2507
02:09:51,666 --> 02:09:52,666
Don't do that.

2508
02:09:52,666 --> 02:09:53,666
Don't ever type in the console.

2509
02:09:53,666 --> 02:09:55,666
And don't sign a weird message.

2510
02:09:55,666 --> 02:09:59,666
If someone sends you a message that's fucking 400 characters long, don't sign that.

2511
02:09:59,666 --> 02:10:01,666
It's all just hex, and you can't.

2512
02:10:01,666 --> 02:10:02,666
You can't reason about it.

2513
02:10:02,666 --> 02:10:03,666
You need to know what you're signing.

2514
02:10:04,666 --> 02:10:09,666
In our thing, it's just one thing that says claim hex to your Ethereum address, and
it's totally fucking safe.

2515
02:10:09,666 --> 02:10:14,666
And if you want to be totally secure, claim each Bitcoin address to a new Ethereum
address,

2516
02:10:14,666 --> 02:10:19,666
and choose a different exit node on your VPN, and clear your cookies.

2517
02:10:22,666 --> 02:10:24,666
You're as anonymous as you entered.

2518
02:10:25,666 --> 02:10:29,666
That doesn't sound, nothing about that seems suspicious to me, but you never know.

2519
02:10:29,666 --> 02:10:30,666
Everyone should check first.

2520
02:10:31,666 --> 02:10:33,666
Don't ever put your private keys online.

2521
02:10:36,666 --> 02:10:39,666
If you use a good wallet, you don't even have to look at your fucking private keys.

2522
02:10:39,666 --> 02:10:40,666
You're literally just signing a message.

2523
02:10:40,666 --> 02:10:42,666
You don't even have to ever see them.

2524
02:10:44,666 --> 02:10:45,666
Well, I mean, what good is that?

2525
02:10:46,666 --> 02:10:47,666
Your computer is seeing them.

2526
02:10:47,666 --> 02:10:48,666
Well, sure.

2527
02:10:50,666 --> 02:10:54,666
If you have a visual bug in your house, and there's a camera, then it reduces that.

2528
02:10:54,666 --> 02:10:56,666
I usually don't see most of what my computer does.

2529
02:10:57,666 --> 02:10:58,666
Right, yeah.

2530
02:10:59,666 --> 02:11:03,666
We've got hardware wallet support, so if you use Electrum, which is a Bitcoin
wallet,

2531
02:11:03,666 --> 02:11:06,666
it supports Trezor and Ledger, and Coldcard, I think.

2532
02:11:06,666 --> 02:11:09,666
And then if you use on the Ethereum side, which is the hex wallet as well,

2533
02:11:09,666 --> 02:11:12,666
if you use Metamask, it supports Trezor and Ledger.

2534
02:11:12,666 --> 02:11:14,666
And so you've got hardware wallet support everywhere.

2535
02:11:15,666 --> 02:11:16,666
It's fucking great.

2536
02:11:16,666 --> 02:11:18,666
Why? Because we chose the right ecosystem.

2537
02:11:19,666 --> 02:11:23,666
Imagine if I had built my own fucking blockchain, worry about 51% of tax all the
time,

2538
02:11:23,666 --> 02:11:26,666
no hardware wallet support, everything's a fucking nightmare.

2539
02:11:27,666 --> 02:11:28,666
So much better the way we did it.

2540
02:11:28,666 --> 02:11:29,666
So much better.

2541
02:11:32,666 --> 02:11:33,666
It's good talking to you, man.

2542
02:11:35,666 --> 02:11:36,666
Yes, this has been fun.

2543
02:11:37,666 --> 02:11:38,666
Anytime.

2544
02:11:38,666 --> 02:11:45,666
I don't know what the future holds for this project that has no physical use in the
world.

2545
02:11:45,666 --> 02:11:47,666
Just look at the top 10, look at the top 100 cryptos.

2546
02:11:48,666 --> 02:11:56,666
I know that the crazy crypto markets have taught all of us many strange lessons.

2547
02:11:57,666 --> 02:12:01,666
In particular, the fact that Zcash can outcompete Zclassic.

2548
02:12:03,666 --> 02:12:06,666
Well, Zcash couldn't outcompete itself because all it's ever done is die.

2549
02:12:08,666 --> 02:12:10,666
Go look at the price chart of Zcash and you'll cry.

2550
02:12:13,666 --> 02:12:16,666
The earlier you bought, the more you lost, basically.

2551
02:12:18,666 --> 02:12:19,666
Oh, yeah, the inflation tax.

2552
02:12:19,666 --> 02:12:23,666
Well, you see, that's the thing, though, is that if it were, well, you know, who
knows?

2553
02:12:24,666 --> 02:12:25,666
Bro, the price chart's fucked.

2554
02:12:26,666 --> 02:12:27,666
No pumps ever.