There's no second best crypto asset. There's a crypto asset, it's called Bitcoin, right?

Right? There's no second best, okay?

I was criticizing the treasury companies when they first started, and I was like,

this is a pointless idea, there's no comparative advantage. Now that is finally, like, playing out.

I was super early to sidechains, and I was super early to L2s, and I was super early

into Lightning, and then I was super early into abandoning Lightning. Sometimes you're

going to ask people questions like, how does the Lightning network work? Or which Lightning

wallets are custodial? You can ask people some questions. A certain number of events could

easily cause strategy to have to go bankrupt, at least certainly from the perspective of the

people who own the common stock, in which case the MNAV premium would be like, who even cares,

because you're getting nothing.

Supported by Cascade. Use your Casper without selling it.

Hi, welcome to XXIM podcast, your home of decentralization. Today, I'm joined by Paul

Sztorc for a second sit-down session to discuss specifically drivechains.

So welcome, Paul, and good to see you again.

Thanks for having me.

Awesome. Now, for anyone new here, Paul is a well-known Bitcoin researcher, developer,

and thinker, and is launching Bitcoin HardFork next month. So coming very soon, in fact,

in a month's time, right? Now, Paul, when we did our first session, it was a wonderful session,

you know, we were just chit-chatting before the recording. I truly enjoyed it. You enjoyed it,

too. So broadly speaking, we touched four topics, right? So we went through

why Bitcoin development is stalled. Correct me, obviously, if you remember other things

we discussed as well. So why Bitcoin development is stalled. BIP-300 and 301, which you've been

working on for over a decade, right? Line merge mine, we went through that, 301. Why Bitcoin cash

and Lightning have struggled to get any meaningful traction adoption, right? We went through a lot,

actually. We discussed a lot on the Lightning front. And the last one is, you know, why you

had to resort to plan B, HardFork with eCash, which is coming soon, right? So that was a quick

summary for someone who didn't watch it. I'll put up a link. What's been the overall feedback

you're getting from the Bitcoin community? You've done a lot of sessions, right?

Well, I think, you know, we expected it to be very controversial, and of course it was.

And you don't know, like, we get a lot of new supporters and a lot of critics. But absolutely

nothing has surprised me whatsoever. It all happened basically exactly the way that I

thought it would. And, you know, a lot of the things that I do, I have a long track record,

a 10-15 year track record in the industry of being very, very early. Like I was super early

in the prediction markets, and I was super early to sidechains, and I was super early to L2s,

and I was super early into Lightning, and then I was super early into abandoning Lightning.

So I have a really, really strong track record of being very early. I have a long history of

saying a lot of things. You know, I say some stuff, like I was criticizing the treasury

companies when they first started, and I was like, this is a pointless idea. There's no

comparative advantage. Now that is finally, like, playing out. So no one has said anything

that has made me think that, you know, in fact, a lot of, a surprising number of people have,

you know, become new supporters, including financial supporters. And so we've had lots of,

you know, people with ideas about content to make and stuff they're going to build. And so

overall, it's been, I would say it was more positive than I thought. I expect it to be super

controversial, which of course it was. I'm not doing it for the sake of controversy. I'm doing

it because, you know, it's the right thing to do. It's really the only solution to the situation

that we're in. And I don't expect a lot of people to understand it because, you know, it's like a

very unusual situation. But because a lot of people just think that Bitcoin doesn't have any problems

at all. So of course, those people are just baffled by why would you even need a new thing?

That's so true, actually. You know, I've been to a few of the Bitcoin halving. The last one I went

to was 2024. And man, people actually, like there'll be 50 people around that, right? It was

a small gathering. But yes, exactly what you say. I don't think people truly understand what goes on

behind the scenes when the development happens, right? Everyone is curious about their wallets

and obviously price action. But I don't think many people care about what's happening and,

you know, the direction of Bitcoin essentially. Sometimes you can ask people questions like,

how does the Lightning Network work? Or, you know, like, what's your, what is the difference,

which Lightning wallets are custodial? You can ask people some questions like, or you can,

and the answers you get are really, even with the treasury companies, you could say,

what's your price target for MSTR? And people will just be like, this question has never even

occurred to them. They just say, oh, I think it can go up because, you know, Michael Saylor is,

you know, a great guy. So these are like, this has become mainstream, it's become retail. I was,

you know, a thought leader in the early days of Bitcoin. So it's just, this is just what it's

like to be very early on, you know, to have your finger on the actual pulse of future,

is that most people aren't there with you yet. Yeah, yeah. And I also think, I think a lot of

people are actually critical of Bitcoin, especially the thinkers, right? The deep thinkers are critical

of Bitcoin, but they never go out to discuss publicly. I think that's where you stand out.

Yeah, everyone is a mindless coward and that they all want to be invited. They got to be

invited to Michael Saylor's New Year party. They got to be invited to the Blockstream after party.

They got to be invited to the Foundry after party of mine, Disrupt at the Big Country Club,

which I've been to all these parties for years and years, five, six, seven years. I've been

Satoshi Roundtail. I've been like all these, there's like, you know, everyone wants to be

invited back. No, it's very hard. There's been a lot of like, there's like a lightning industrial

complex. Cause like so many people have invested with lightning. So then there's a lot of pressure

for people to say, Oh, what do you think of tarot or whatever? Uh, blah, blah, blah. And so you're,

everyone's supposed to just be, this is what they call log rolling in, in politics where everyone,

everyone says, that's really great. And everyone just stays really positive all the time.

And that's, that's, that's productive to some extent, but we've been doing that for basically

like 10, 15 years. And it's now become like a totally delusional, counterproductive

call. And we have to escape while we still go. There's still time to escape.

Yeah. And I would have thought, you know, after all the sessions you've done,

you know, people would be more like open to the ideas that you're presenting,

given you've been on, you've got a track record of really, you know,

I have a really, really long track record and I have an extremely accurate track record also.

I was thinking that after all these sessions, right, people would be more

open to those ideas because not only, you know, you've been, you have a track record,

but also on top of that, you, um, you know, you are giving a new coin.

Giving everyone free money. I'm really respecting people. I'm saying here's this free BIP 300

for free. The idea is free, even before the e-cash hard form. So this idea is free.

And then they're kind of saying, well, we don't want it. And I'm saying,

fine, then don't, then don't take it. And now give you some other free thing.

And, and then people don't like that because humans are, you know, very social,

everyone is conformist. Everyone cares about status. Everyone cares about,

they care about being invited to the parties. They care about getting compliments. They don't,

you know, so it's, it's, uh, people are just like that.

You know, I was doing some research for this episode, right? I was going through your ex

profile and man, I couldn't keep up with the number of outlets that have been invited to

you to discuss, you know, um, e-cash and including your latest session, I think with the Mara

foundation, uh, really, I think I felt it really shows the Bitcoin wider community is looking for

a story right outside of Michael Saylor and price action, which you are, which you're giving it to

them or gave it to them with e-cash. Uh, what's your, like, you know, are you seeing these haters

somewhat opening up? Well, you know, the thing you have in the notes is that we did raise the

$5 million. So we had mostly raised it before announcing in April, but after that we quickly

closed it up. So, so it's like people, some people are haters and some people, you know,

talk as cheap as they say. Yeah. So we had some people, big supporters, some people, big haters,

but then actually, you know, the fundraising came in much more easily. So, um, but yeah,

and then many people, I completely agree with what you said about, we, we haven't had any new

story for a really long time. It was really already boring in 2022, I would say. And then

the treasury companies and kind of like nation state adoption, like maybe El Salvador, that was

like the next thing. But then that also has played out where that hasn't quite, you know, cause the,

was the Chivo wallet or whatever in El Salvador, these people are like, not very, these are like

very poor people. A lot of them don't like know that much about how to operate a computer and

stuff like that. So they just like the, and then the actual wallet is like fully custodial,

it's tied to their version of social security number, like the government ID. So it's like

a nightmare. It's like the exact opposite of Bitcoin. Um, so that was like a new thing,

but really there's not that much new stuff. And then of course, one funny thing that happened

in my, I thought was entertaining was, okay, so you had the treasury companies, which I always

thought were not that great of an idea. And then you had, uh, that what Bitcoin did episode

with Danny, where he was kind of taking them seriously. And he was, and he was asking Michael

Saylor like, oh yeah, you've got this great idea, the treasury company and the preferreds.

And now other people are copying the idea. So in a sane world, that would be a, that would be a

polite question and a compliment, right? Cause it would be like, oh, what if, you know, Elon Musk

is saying, oh, we should have electric cars. We should have self-driving cars. Now everyone's

Ford is doing that too. That would be an opportunity for a normal person to say,

yeah, I was right the whole time. This is a great idea. But instead he had this defensive rant for

like 24 minutes or something, and then saying that it's insulting, he's insulting him and stuff.

So I think that speaks to this like dawning self-awareness that everyone's realizing this

idea is kind of fake and there's no, you know, we could review, this is econ 101 about comparative

advantage, which is to say, if Elon, you could invest in SpaceX or in Tesla, which whatever you

think of Elon is certainly a very controversial person. And he says some insane tweets sometimes,

and you just kind of groan and think whatever, but the guy knows how to run a company.

You, when you invest in, you give cash to Tesla, they use the cash to buy stuff like the factory,

the land, they build the factory on the raw materials, they assemble the car,

they're better at building a car than the investor, I the investor am, they can do it better than me,

but they don't have cash. So it's a mutually beneficial, I'm giving them what they need,

they're then they do give me something that I need, they give me a return on my investment.

Or of course, if you buy the car, you know, how long would it take someone to assemble a car by

working only by themselves, it would take forever. But you go to your job, you work.

So this is the econ 101, you know, and now with everything you've just learned,

see, because the comparative advantage means it's mutually beneficial for both people to

complete the trade. And this is why, as Benjamin Franklin said, here on this, this recording this

on July 4, in America, he said no nation was ever ruined by trade. He was right, because the trade

only takes place if it benefits both people. So this is all just a review. But the Treasury

company is kind of there is no comparative because you could buy Bitcoin yourself. So if there's no

comparative advantage, then it's one person is kind of winning and one person is kind of losing.

And that's all you need to know to decode all this stuff about stretch and preferreds. It's all

someone is gaining at the expense of someone else. And usually the MSTR stockholders are the ones

losing out because you just print that in unlimited supply. But you only need this one

little tool from econ 101, which everyone should have in their toolkit. I hope everyone takes this

to heart and learns this the same as they would learn, you know, anything else they would need

in life. This is a key thing, because this is how you go from a situation where two people cooperate

and their lives improve to a situation versus an exploitative or a foolish situation where one

person is losing. I think what you're mentioning is like productive asset versus financial

engineering, right? Like essentially, you know, with Tesla's example, obviously you give money

and they deploy into some productive assets, car example, right? SpaceX or whatever. I think here

with the strategy, I think it's completely different because, you know, same thing with

ETFs, also the same thing. Well, I would like to give, you know, if I may one tiny

cheer for financial engineering and say that it's not so bad. Sometimes there's lots of stuff such

as insurance, which is just moving money around, but that still helps make the world

move around because someone, you could say in a situation where someone's not a helper,

they have medical malpractice insurance or any other type of insurance, you'd say, well, I can't

open my doctor's office until I have my medical degree and I've saved up a bunch of cash in case

the very first patient I have sues me or threatens to sue me or the very first customer I have.

But with the world of insurance, the insurance people come in and they'll say, listen,

as long as you check these boxes, it doesn't matter if it's the first guy or the last guy.

So insurance will create a lot of opportunity. Insurance is a case where you're just moving

financial engineering and it will still benefit people. And in fact, the idea of investing that

I brought up before, you have a situation where like maybe a young child has a new idea for like

their lawn mowing business or something. They want to start up a business. And then like maybe an

older guy has a bunch of cash saved under the mattress and they can cooperate. And you could

say that's just financial engineering, but it's still a comparative advantage because

one person has an idea and they're willing to work, but they don't have money. The other person

has the cash, but they don't have, they're not getting a return on it.

So financial engineering is actually fine by me as long as there is some, it's all about

comparative advantage. You have to say, what am I getting out of this deal that I wouldn't get

from myself? So you could buy Bitcoin. That's why the treasury company doesn't make any sense.

You could just buy Bitcoin whenever you want. You don't have to pay. MicroStrategy has all

these lawyers. They have like a giant brick and they have like a building. They have accountants

that have to pay extra taxes, fees, compliance and stuff. You have to deal with the risk that

they'll just lose all the coins. So yeah. What about Grayscale? Because obviously MicroStrategy

is relatively new, you know, post 2020. Grayscale, you know, been around for a long

time. Or ETFs. What's your take on those two fronts? Because in a way, you know,

they're doing the same thing. Of course, slightly different.

It's a very important difference. When MicroStrategy first came out,

because Bitcoin went through a long period where there were no ETFs. So actually there is a

comparative advantage because people have their money locked in a certain, I don't know how to

describe it. It's like in pension funds or it's in like the IRAs. And the IRAs, there's no option

to buy Bitcoin in the IRA or at least there wasn't for a really long time. So people create these

ETFs and this is a comparative advantage because now instead of withdrawing money from the IRA,

which is very inconvenient, it has like tax implications and stuff. Instead, you'd have to

withdraw it from the IRA and then buy Bitcoin like with a briefcase full of cash on local

Bitcoins or something weird like that, especially in these investment amounts that are like, you

know, tens of thousands of dollars or more. That would be like really impractical. So this is a

case where you could not buy Bitcoin through your setup. But then the ETF. Another important

difference is that the ETF doesn't claim to mess around with this MNAV premium or Bitcoin per share

or whatever. It just says, if you buy this, we'll give you the equivalent amount of a Bitcoin

exposure. And so it's fixed at basically 1.0, whereas Strategy was trying to say like, oh,

I literally have like clips because I couldn't believe that he said something so ridiculous,

but I have the bookmark and downloaded, which they haven't even been ashamed enough to delete

them. But there was like the CEO of Strategy, that other guy, Fong Lee or whatever his name is,

I don't remember. I don't even really care that much. But he was saying like

the MNAV had gone from like 1.0 to 2.0 and he was saying, yeah, it could go from 2.0 to 10.0 or

maybe even to 20.0. And the ETFs just say, of course, now it's like below 1.0. So it's like

the ETFs just say we will fix it at 1.0. And you can see this is much more honest. This is like

you go to the ATM machine and they say, we'll give you $20 in cash for every $20 in your bank

account. We're not going to like, there's not going to be like an ATM premium or something

that could go up or down or whatever. It may go to zero. In fact, if a certain number of things

happen, a certain number of events could easily cause Strategy to have to go bankrupt, at least

certainly from the perspective of the people who own the common stock, because there's this other

thing that people may not know. This is all like arcane minutiae to most people. But there's this

thing, this pecking order idea that when in a corporation in the United States, like you have

to pay all the people you owe money to first, so that you have to pay like the debt holders first,

then these preferred people get paid out. They all get paid out 100% before the guy at the very

bottom of the list. You're talking about Chapter 11 bankruptcy or Chapter 7, right? In the bankruptcy

quote, right? So the shareholder is the bottom, Class 11 or something, right? At the bottom of

the class. So they could very easily get wiped out and get zero, in which case the MNAB premium

would be like, who even cares, because you're getting nothing. You invested all this money and

you get zero back. So that's theoretically completely possible that they will get some

kind of lawsuit for fraud, or they get some kind of corporate takeover, where someone says,

hey, you know, we just want you to liquidate this company and give all the Bitcoin to the

investors or something. I'm not saying that's going to happen anytime soon, but it's completely

theoretically possible. Whereas with the ETF, you can see that that would never happen,

because the ETF charges a tiny little convenience fee of like half a percent or whatever it is,

and they just say, and that ensures that it's a fully sustainable.

Yeah, I think the only, I do agree, I don't personally think micro strategy or strategy

is going under chapter 11, chapter 7. I don't personally think, but it's a good discussion.

At least it should be discussed openly, right? But I think what I was going to say,

issue I have with the ETFs is the creation redemption process of ETFs are very,

is behind the closed doors with the dealers and issuers. There's a lot of financial injury

happens during the creation redemption process. And that's something we don't get to see.

No, of course, it's better to buy the Bitcoin and hold it on the Bitcoin network if you can.

And it's, I don't think it's that hard. It's not, of course, you do have to invest like a weekend

and figure out like, okay, how do I know what's going on? Is my computer hacked? How do I download

this wallet software? What does it mean to, what are our private keys? So it is a learning

experience. But we learn to do, as people living in the modern times, we learned, a lot of people

learn how to drive a car. A lot of people learn how to, just like how to connect to Wi-Fi and

stuff. It's actually kind of tricky, as we all know, sometimes you have to do various

rituals until I get the Wi-Fi to connect. So it's just something that I think is worth,

if you're going to invest, if someone's going to invest like 10, 20 hours and learn about Bitcoin

and then decide to invest their money in it, you should invest like another 10 or so hours into

figuring out, oh, how do the private keys work? This is all like, this all goes into why you

would invest. You'd say, this helps you figure out what it is you're actually buying. So that's

very healthy. We, like people just buy on Coinbase, it kind of like nulls you to the, you're kind of

numb to the pain of, but that also means that you are more remote. You don't understand as much,

like why is, why is Bitcoin different? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, if you're investing in Bitcoin or

any crypto for that matter, at least learn why you're doing that outside of just financial

gains. Right. And I think that's the unfortunate part. A lot of people come in to make money,

but then eventually they end up holding the bag, right. Because, or they think they end up holding

the bag because price might go up by the time they already sold. So I think what you're saying

is precisely what people need to do is to understand, you know, start with the white

paper, at least read the white paper. Let's come back, I think, let's come back. No, this is not

like a financial, this is not like a personal finance podcast. We've changed the topic today,

but that's a beautiful discussion. So it's just coming back to it. You know, one thing you said,

you guys, Layer 2 Labs and eCash, you guys have raised what, $5 million? So I wanted to get into

a little bit of that discussion, you know, who's supporting the effort? Is it a family or friends

round or is it some serious capital backing it? Mostly, yes. And in fact, I have to say we've

never, even though we sent out to like big funds, we sent like the slide deck. It's funny, like the,

there's like, I have like the gray matter, like website with like a lot of text and like a lot of

like, and so that converts a lot of people who get really excited about it and tell their friends.

And then like, we have like the really polished slide deck. I think that's like converted like

zero people. They're very funny, but we're like basically, so we raised the 3 million back in

2022 and we've come this far just with that. And then we just very recently raised 5 million. So

if people, anyone who was, everyone who was a hater before, look out because now it's about

to get even worse from your point of view. But like, so it was great. And most of it was raised

even before the April announcement and people continue to invest and tell their friends.

We, I would like for there to be a way for people to invest. That's that kind of, because you have

to balance a lot of factors. You don't want it to be like, you don't want to like go to

retail people who are more gullible and just be like, buy this now and stuff. So I was always

very, very, very like clamped down on like saying like, this is like word of mouth and we need to

know like, you know, exactly everyone's, you know, everyone's real name and stuff. So it was very

like traditional like contract type of a thing. But of course, very soon the project will launch

and if you, you know, I think even not that many people actually even know about it. Like we're

going to try to do as best we can to make sure everyone does know about it. But if, you know,

if you're listening to this podcast now, you're probably like, even when it launches, you'll

probably be like, you know, what are the people, people hear about it in certain stages. So

probably hearing about it on the stage is my guess. And yeah, we're using that money for

development, education, et cetera. You need to,

for the, to help because with hard fork, you want it to be,

you want to have fully prepared on launch day. So you want to do a lot of work upfront.

Yeah. So do you, like, are you happy to share who's backing it or names that people mostly?

It's mostly like just people who have been in the industry a long time.

Crypto, Bitcoin OGs that people have had been following me or drive chain project for a while.

We have like a tiny little cult, I guess, but then it's like, they're also their friends.

So it is usually people who have been in the industry for like a really long time, like five or 10 years.

Like that's mostly what it is.

And then like some random other people as well.

So, but it has not been, it's funny, I would, you know, it is weird.

I think there are, there are a lot of things that are kind of almost people who almost invested and then it kind of like just petered out, which is interesting.

We haven't, as I said, we did not have like, like a big fund, like an A16Z.

We didn't have any of anything like that, even though we of course emailed and some people knew through the professional network.

And yeah, it's really surprising who you would think would be a big supporter versus who some people, they could be like a huge supporter of yours for years.

And they'll just say, oh yeah, this is a genius.

And then they never invest, which is weird because the, and then other people, you could just be like someone who, you know, like has like kind of maybe liked some of your Twitter posts.

And they, someone tells them about it.

They just message and they're just like, yeah, they want to invest like $300,000 or something.

It's like one, like one single conversation.

And then you're like, oh, I guess that person is actually really the actual supporter.

So it's kind of interesting, like to what extent people are just, you know, flattering you maybe.

And like, it's a very interesting exercise.

I highly recommend it to anyone who wants to jump off of this cliff.

If you do the fundraising, it's kind of like you really tell like, whoa, like some of these people are really, really big believers.

And all of these people are kind of not.

So it's a very intriguing, very intriguing event.

Yeah, I've had my personal experience, but yeah, I think a hundred percent, you just don't know exactly what you're saying, right?

You just don't know who's going to back you, right?

Even the people that you think are going to back you, they're going to pull out last minute, right?

But that's great.

Congrats to you guys, you know, obviously showing there is capital coming behind this effort, which is always good because I'm a big believer to have, you know, to raise as much as possible when the time is right.

Don't wait for that moment, right?

So it's great that you raised.

Yeah, and then like what people would say is like a horrible bear market.

I don't think it was that, but until recently, back when we raised it, it was only, it was sort of bad.

But people, even in January, people were saying, this is like when we sort of started the five million man.

People were like, this is the worst time ever to raise.

Somehow, somehow ended up doing it.

So I think that maybe, maybe this month might be even worse.

Luckily, long since we raised the five million dollar round.

So let's move forward, right?

So done your fundraise.

So now you're running, actually, you know, getting to the, obviously the finish line or start line, whatever you want to call it.

You are running this 100k bounty to find major vulnerabilities, you know, and you've got 21 submissions, which I saw.

Yeah, we had 11 people enter round one and we had 10 people enter round two.

Well, the way the contest works is if you, any bugs you find, you can submit, but there's like a little organization.

There's like a hierarchy to them.

So some of the software is much more mission critical.

And other software is kind of new.

And so it's obviously, or it's way more complicated.

So it obviously is more likely to have some kind of bugs.

And then the bugs themselves could be different.

Some could like crash the whole network.

And then others would just be like, this doesn't do like kind of what it says it does.

It'll be like a minor bug.

So people are really, really good at finding bugs.

This is another tool everyone should have is that, okay, if you hire someone and you say, oh, I'm going to pay this person, whatever it is, whatever, $20 an hour, I don't know.

You're going to pay someone to paint your house or something, I don't know.

I'm just making this up.

But if you say you pay them by the hour, then, you know, they're going to take, they're going to do a good job.

They're going to take their sweet time though, because you're paying for each hour.

So you get a lot of, you end up getting a lot of hours from their work because you're paying by the hour.

But if you just say, hey, I'm going to, you say, I'm leaving for the weekend, paint my entire house and then leave.

And I'll pay you whatever, whatever it is, $5,000, just making all this up.

But then they will try to do it quickly, which might be bad, might be good.

But they're not going to be wasting any time because they're going to think, hey, as soon as we finish, we can just get out of here with him and whoever else is painting.

Now I'm saying it's a whole crew or something.

So yeah, maybe he'll call all his friends and they'll just paint the house in like four hours and then they'll leave.

And so with the contest, we paid people based on how many bugs, who could find more bugs than other people.

So now people have found a lot.

Some are not that important.

Many of them are duplicates, et cetera.

But yeah, this contest model is superior to like the grant model.

Grant model is like you look around and you say, who should we hire basically?

And we'll say, oh, we'll pay you whatever, $50,000 a year to write a journalism article.

And now you're stuck with that person.

You've given them the grant.

And then of course they come back to you next year and they say, let's renew the grant so that we can keep this going.

And then in stark contrast to that, you have the contest model.

You say, listen, whoever submits the best journalism article on whatever, solar energy, painting houses,

whoever submits the best journalism article wins $50,000 prize.

That's a lot better because people self-select.

Someone only tries that if they think that they can do it better than everyone else.

And you usually have like a couple of options.

Now it's also bad because you have risk aversion and you have like, you know, so it's not perfect.

But yeah, we did this contest model, it's great.

And people have found a lot of bugs, which is very, very helpful.

We haven't found any that are like two.

There are like one or two.

But yeah, people like have the giant AI, like teams of AIs like talking to each other to help them find bugs.

So then they make giant reports and stuff like that.

So people are finding the good bugs, which is, that's exactly what we wanted.

So it's working very well.

And we are doing lots and lots of stuff.

So we have like, it's hard to explain the whole software stack, but it's like layer one is just Bitcoin core.

Then we have this QSYF BIP300301 activator, which activates the software without touching Bitcoin.

But that's its own piece of software.

That's basically done.

But then we have all the L2s.

And then we have the wallet, we have the mobile wallet, and we have the desktop wallet, Bitwindow.

Mobile wallet is ecash.com.

Wallet you can get from ecash.com slash download.

You can try all this stuff out with like the fake coins, which I highly encourage everyone to do.

So we have lots and lots of stuff that you could see for yourself.

You get the fake coins, you can play around with it.

And that is a very effective way of, for you to see my point of view and you see like, oh, this is what this project is actually about.

So that's very helpful.

On top of all that, we want to do like all kinds of other stuff.

So like Bitwindow, the wallets have, they have like all these cool features that you could use on the regular Bitcoin network today.

We have like much better, let's say, we have much better, we're the same deniability.

We have like lots and lots and lots of cool stuff.

And on top of that, I would like to do a second QSYF activator to have some things that should also be on Bitcoin's L1 without even editing the Bitcoin core L1.

So that we could have, I think in particular, OpVault and like a bunch of quantum resistant signature options for people.

They can be just options.

And I think that those would be something that would be attractive to people on L1.

And I have this thing QSYF, C-U-S-F, the core untouched soft fork, where you can do these soft forks without modifying Bitcoin core.

So it's Bitcoin core when they keep putting out a new version, we just merge the changes.

We don't do anything with that.

We don't even touch that.

And so it's possible to do soft fork without modifying the Bitcoin core code and so that we keep that on L1.

We just don't even, we don't even change that.

So that's very advantageous.

So we have a lot of stuff that we are doing.

And then, you know, we do all this stuff.

And then it's more stuff for people to find in the bug contest, but it's very helpful.

See, this is a much more healthy thing.

You know, if you just hire someone to say, OK, look for bugs and report them.

You know, you'll get some kind of report that has some bugs.

But if instead you say, oh, you will get more money if you find more bugs, especially if you beat the rival person.

Well, then your people are aggressively fine.

They're like the best day of their life is when they find a bug that no one else can find.