0:00 Hello, and welcome to... 2:30 Welcome to Drivechain Twitter Spaces. 2:51 If you have a question or comment about Drivechain, come on up to the stage. 2:58 Don't be shy. 3:00 Bring your question or comment. 3:05 Welcome Mr. P.B. 3:08 If you would like to come on up to the stage, you are welcome to. 3:29 This is Drivechain Twitter Spaces. 3:31 We discuss Bitcoin Improvement Proposal 300 and 301, a transformative update for Bitcoin 3:41 that can introduce peer-to-peer sidechains for scaling privacy, DNS, smart contracts, 3:53 and all kinds of other interesting blockchain-based applications, enabling the Bitcoin community 4:00 to stop worrying about creativity harming the mainchain, and instead embrace creativity 4:08 on the sidechains. 4:12 Let a thousand flowers bloom. 4:18 If you have a question or comment about Drivechain for Bitcoin, come on up. 4:26 Welcome everyone. 4:29 Come on up with your question or comment about Drivechain. 4:34 We meet every Monday and Thursday to discuss Drivechain. 4:43 All are welcome to join the stage and ask a question. 4:46 Ask a question or comment. 4:50 Don't be shy. 5:03 Bitcoin Improvement Proposals 300 and 301 are the subject of our conversation today. 5:14 We look forward to the first questioner or commenter. 7:14 Welcome to the audience, Mr. HuluVooBlueRSK, co-founder of Bedtime Labs. 7:43 Welcome, Mr. HuluVooBlueRSK. 8:11 This is Drivechain Twitter Spaces. 8:22 We meet every Monday and Thursday for questions and comments on Drivechain. 8:27 Come on up to the stage if you would like to ask a question or share a comment about 8:36 Drivechain. 8:37 Don't be shy. 8:39 Raise your hand and come on up to chat. 8:44 The whole purpose of these spaces is to have open discussion about how advanced sidechains 8:51 can help Bitcoin foster innovation. 8:56 We have a request to speak. 8:59 Fantastic. 9:00 Hello, sir. 9:02 Welcome, Mr. BedtimeLabs.RSK. 9:08 The mic is yours. 9:09 Take it away. 9:10 Hey, how's it going, guys? 9:11 This is HuluVooBlue with Bedtime Labs. 9:12 I'm already building on RSK. 9:13 I just came into the spaces to get some updates on Drivechains. 9:14 I'm pretty excited about the whole Layer 2 stuff in general and happy to be here. 9:15 That is awesome. 9:16 We at LayerTwo Labs think RSK is awesome because RSK is the most significant infrastructure 9:17 on RSK. just came into the spaces to get some updates on Drivechains. 9:24 I'm pretty excited about the whole LayerTwo stuff in general. 9:28 Happy to be here. 9:30 That is awesome. 9:31 We at LayerTwo Labs think RSK is awesome because 9:35 is the most significant sidechain on Bitcoin that is 9:40 merged mine, 9:43 which is really cool. 9:45 It's my understanding, having chatted with Gabriel Kerman, the co -founder, 9:50 RSK 9:52 is generating three Bitcoin per month in transaction fees. 9:58 I think that's so great, like for the Bitcoin miners. 10:01 That's cool. 10:03 I wonder where I can find that data. 10:05 I would love to see, like, I 10:08 I would like to check that often. 10:09 I would like to check that often. 10:12 If you have any thoughts, you can let me know. 10:16 I know they just redid their website and they just did an overhaul to the RIF 10:22 website as well, which is the Rootstock Infrastructure Framework. 10:25 they actually have a like zk roll -up 10:30 of RSK, so I guess you could say it's Bitcoin Layer3, and they're going to using that 10:35 for super fast transactions and pay gas fees with whatever tokens you 10:41 have. it'll automatically swap it to Bitcoin, so it can go ahead and pay those gas 10:45 fees. I guess if you have Ethereum, you can 10:49 come over and kind of pay gas with the Ethereum it'll auto swap it just to help with 10:53 onboarding not ease of access to help get those Bitcoin miners more Bitcoin which is 10:59 the whole purpose staying with the security budget isn't it interesting how the 11:05 security budget is 11:08 not in the discourse right now because fees are high, but instead 11:14 there is discussion of the need to scale Bitcoin. 11:19 just like the security budget assists people in understanding the potential value of 11:25 sidechains because 11:27 it can be boosted through merged mining. 11:32 Scaling Bitcoin assists people in understanding the value of sidechains 11:37 because when fees are high on layer one we need to have layers. 11:44 it's a kind of a great catch 11:49 Totally. 11:51 Like a virtuous cycle. 11:53 Well, yeah, mean, whether fees are low or high, a compelling case can be made 11:58 for Drivechain, because we need scaling layers. 12:03 Now one of the 12:05 toughest parts about selling sidechains is people say, well, if sidechains were great, 12:10 why haven't the federated ones seen a ton of success on Bitcoin? 12:17 if we had - Because we don't have drivechains yet. 12:19 I know, but they wouldn't be - That's why. 12:22 But there are federated solutions that 12:24 have done well in Ethereum. 12:28 Like not everything in Ethereum is fully peer to peer and yet some of the stuff has 12:32 done well. 12:36 For example, 12:39 wrapped Bitcoin is a totally federated, like 12:45 single company federated multi -sig that has $4 billion of Bitcoin 12:50 involved. So people are willing to trust things 12:56 sometimes. why like rapid going is not peer to 13:00 peer. The company BitGo is like issuing it, right? 13:05 If I'm not mistaken. 13:06 So just one question people have about Drivechain is they say, why isn't Liquid and 13:11 RSK, why aren't they bigger? 13:13 Like, if sidechains were good, wouldn't, like, first generation sidechains be more 13:18 successful? 13:23 Yeah, honestly, I was really surprised they don't have more traction than they already 13:28 do. 13:30 seems like most of the cases, the Sovereign is the most popular thing on RSK. 13:36 Fantastic, I use it all the time. 13:39 yeah, there's not too many users on these things yet. 13:43 I feel like, you know, the maxi fud of, it's a federated thing, the miners can steal 13:47 your coins. well, RSK is like merge mining bitcoins. 13:51 you think the Bitcoin miners are going to steal your coins, then I mean, okay. 13:57 And like, we've been begging for Drivechain, and 13:59 the ones who say we shouldn't have it anyway. 14:01 And then they get ordinals and yeah, then they get mad. 14:10 So... Well said. 14:14 Well said. 14:17 Yeah, and then the whole 14:18 whole ordinals thing, well, I think it's kind of a non -issue. 14:22 There's no more security budget FUD pretty much ever. 14:26 might go away though. 14:28 Like the ordinals, the fees might subside and then there's low fees again. 14:32 Oh, I think they will. 14:34 But then we can always threaten to, oh, we're going to put a bunch of sub 14:38 can always 14:43 and 14:55 get high fees again. 14:56 I think if 14:57 the fees come and go this cycle, it'll teach a lot of people that these things can't 15:02 relied upon. Like we can't rely on high fees in the future unless they 15:08 appear to be sustainable. 15:10 If they just come in sporadic spikes, then that's not going to increase the security 15:15 budget. 15:17 Eric Wall had a good tweet on this. 15:18 The security budget is not a function of the past miner revenue. 15:24 It's a function of future expected miner revenue. 15:32 If the miners think that there will be a lot of fees in the future, then they will consume 15:36 more resources to hash. 15:40 That causes the cost of being a 51% miner to be high. 15:48 If there is an occasional spike in fees, the miners get a windfall, but if they don't expect 15:54 those fees to happen again and again, then it isn't actually going to increase the security 16:00 budget as much as you would think because you need to have predictably high fees in 16:06 order for the security budget to increase. 16:10 Because the security budget is a function of future expected income, not the future 16:17 actual income, but the future expected income. 16:21 Do you agree? 16:22 Yeah, no. 16:23 I completely agree. 16:24 I was more pointing to the fact of the idea that Bitcoin can never even get enough fees 16:33 to make a sustainable fee structure. 16:37 We saw blocks that had a higher fee. 16:39 I'm not saying that everything's fixed, we don't need to do anything. 16:45 We definitely need sidechains that are a merge mine that support the security budget in line 16:50 with it. 16:51 But you know what I'm saying, Ethereum folks and stuff who don't even like Bitcoin at all 16:59 saying that, hey, Bitcoin is already a non-starter because it can never survive because it can 17:07 never, for whatever reason, generate enough fees. 17:10 We know it's possible to get enough fees. 17:14 Now we just need to work on a way to sustain that and to harness that appetite. 17:18 And we see all these people building now. 17:21 And so I've never seen as much talk about sidechains on Bitcoin and roll-ups as we have 17:27 in the past four days now. 17:34 So there was a time in 2017 when the Coinbase was smaller than the fees in the block. 17:46 So we've had this situation where the fees were larger than the amount of value that 17:53 the miner received from the Coinbase. 18:00 So that has occurred before. 18:03 In December of 2017, the fees were very high and it was over $50 to send a Bitcoin transaction. 18:11 And that was when Greg Maxwell wrote that email publicly where he said he's breaking 18:16 out the champagne because we're seeing fees that are high enough to pay for security late 18:21 in the far future when the Coinbase has been halved to zero. 18:29 So the thing you're saying, we already knew that it was possible to see high fees and 18:35 I think that gave people a lot of false confidence and made people complacent. 18:39 People thought, okay, wow, the fees are really high. 18:43 This will happen again and again. 18:45 Surely there'll be high fees and Bitcoin again and again. 18:48 But then we had like five years where for a lot of the time the fee was not high. 18:54 So I think that it's possible that we'll see low fees in the future and the security 19:00 budget problem will be back. 19:02 This is confounding to a lot of people. 19:04 A lot of people think, well, if Bitcoin adoption is like the fastest growing thing in the history 19:09 of the world, surely the block space will become congested and fees will rise. 19:16 But I believe that the pro-drivechain view is that without a lot of merged mining going 19:22 on, it's very possible that we won't get enough fees. 19:28 It's especially likely that we'll have not enough fees if a lot of fees on blockchains 19:33 are being paid on blockchains that have nothing to do with Bitcoin. 19:39 So every time someone transacts in wrapped Bitcoin or Liquid or Ethereum, there are no 19:49 transaction fees paid to Bitcoin miners. 19:52 So we need more merged mining in order to fix this security budget. 19:57 That's like the pro-drivechain view. 19:59 I think, however, I think to make a comprehensive argument about that, though, would require 20:04 like a very advanced economic analysis for someone to somehow model the whole universe 20:10 and find out whether or not the transaction fees will be enough to fund security. 20:19 It's very complicated. 20:20 There's all kinds of assumptions in there about the value of Bitcoin and the innovations 20:25 that can be expected regarding people trying to transact inexpensively. 20:37 Yeah. And at what point in cost do people stop interacting on mainchain and just go 20:44 to one of those sidechains that doesn't merge mine? 20:48 And what are the implications? 20:50 And yeah, could there ever be a shock if we suddenly saw fees like quadruple 20:55 one day and then people just suddenly stop using it? 20:59 Like, would we see some kind of security shock where we saw the hash rate fluctuate 21:05 like greatly within one day or two or something? 21:08 I don't know. I don't really know enough about that side of things. 21:13 What is bedtime? 21:17 I guess Bitcoin ecosystem development. 21:19 We made a little drawings, little draw pictures on some NFTs on RSK. 21:26 Cool. 21:28 So using IPNS, which is like a protocol within IPFS where you can actually most people 21:35 think, OK, yeah, you make your NFT, you got your token URI there and it points to an 21:39 IPFS file, which is a content identified file. 21:43 If anything in that file changes one pixel, it's a completely different hash. 21:49 So it's a permanent thing. 21:50 However, IPNS is a protocol where basically just points to a different immutable file 21:57 and the user can actually change that. 21:59 So you can come on, mint a NFT canvas, draw a smiley face, send it to your friend and 22:06 your friend can draw a mustache and a funny hat on and kind of like an MVP for maybe 22:12 like a decentralized docusign one day. 22:15 You got to get encryption and a couple of other things added, but it's more of a fun 22:20 just little learning experience for me more than anything. 22:26 And built on RSK because, yeah, merge mining. 22:30 Cool. So you like Drivechain primarily because of the merge mining or for another 22:36 reason? 22:39 Yeah, 100 percent because of the merge mining. 22:42 Like when I was looking to build this project, I mean. 22:46 Probably would have had more users on Polygon or something, but I don't really like 22:51 those other things. And honestly, actually, in my research, I went to Vitalik's website 22:57 and I read about sold out tokens and I decided I didn't want to do anything to do with 23:02 Ethereum. I mean, yeah, sure, RSK is an EVM, but yeah, I didn't want anything to do 23:10 with that project or that side of this crypto space. 23:15 In case he might steal your soul? 23:19 Well, if you go to his website and read that, it's a little frightening, just the 23:25 assumptions that he seems to have about the future of where his technology might go. 23:33 Well, I read his whole book, Proof of Stake, which was a collection of his more 23:39 important essays. 23:42 I am familiar with his work. 23:47 I think that maybe if Drivechain's adopted, Ethereum will go all the way to zero. 23:53 However, I think it would require the Bitcoin community to really rally around this 23:58 idea and make it work in an exciting way. 24:00 For example, let's say the Bitcoin community adopts Drivechain and then many users 24:06 embrace these sidechains. 24:08 They send money to the sidechains and start using them for privacy, for DNS, for smart 24:14 contracts, for Thunder, large block, low fee transactions. 24:21 If we make use of all these different projects, then we can make a lot of money. 24:26 Then all of these planned Drivechains would have billions of dollars of value. 24:32 If just 1% of Bitcoiners were in each of them, each would have $4 billion. 24:38 So it would be very exciting to see Bitcoin have all these interesting sidechains 24:43 operating on top of it. 24:45 And it could be a very successful thing for Bitcoin, where Bitcoin would have this 24:51 narrative of innovation and experimentation and growth and creativity. 24:58 And it would be a very exciting time for Bitcoin. 25:04 And then the base chain could benefit from ossification. 25:12 So that would, yeah, Bitcoin would have very strong narratives. 25:17 And then I think all the narratives of Ethereum would be displaced. 25:25 So I think there could be a big change. 25:28 The Bitcoin community could really pivot in an exciting way, potentially, with 25:35 advanced sidechains. 25:43 Yeah, I agree. 25:43 And one of the other reasons why I like RSK so much, just kind of in my research, 25:51 both of my projects, I was researching IPFS, kind of its history, where it came 25:57 from, where it's going and all that stuff. 25:59 And one of the members of the Consensus Labs, which is a part of IPFS, Marko 26:06 Bukolic wrote this paper on the future of decentralized computing. 26:11 And he talks about how Filecoin and things like that need to be rooted and anchored 26:19 on Bitcoin rather than a proof of stake system. 26:22 And he goes into the technical arguments, why that's a necessity. 26:25 If you're going to have an actual decentralized system, it needs to be rooted 26:30 on a base layer that's actually decentralized. 26:33 He explains it extremely well thought out. 26:37 And that kind of really solidified my idea. 26:41 Stacks is cool and stuff like that, but it is a necessity for it to be merge mined. 26:47 Because otherwise, if it's not getting its security from Bitcoin, then it's just 26:53 faking it. It's just some remora chain being like, look, we put our hash on the 26:58 Bitcoin blockchain. We used to say that that hash is legit. 27:06 Yes. 27:11 I mean, it seems so obvious to me, but there's so many other people out there that 27:17 don't get it yet. But hey, man, I've been in since 2018, so I've only kind of, you 27:24 know, seen the light in the past, about, I don't know, 16 months. 27:29 It's a while to come around, I guess, for some of us. 27:33 Well, many people have taken a long time to figure everything out. 27:47 Actually, yeah, I guess BIP300 has probably been around longer than I've been in the 27:52 space. 27:55 Yeah. 27:57 Well, 28:10 this is drivechain Twitter spaces, we meet every day. 28:14 This is drivechain Twitter spaces, we meet every Monday and Thursday on Twitter 28:19 space to discuss drivechain. Bitcoin Improving Proposal 300 and 301. 28:29 Enabling Bitcoin to have sidechains that are, as Adam Back has said, 28:34 sidechains that are more peer-to-peer would be stronger and more resilient, and 28:38 more harmonious with Bitcoin than the sidechains we have today. 28:44 Sidechains that are more peer-to-peer means sidechains in which no one is 28:48 necessarily the only one. 28:51 And so, 28:51 instead, a sidechain that uses drivechain would rely on the dynamic, global 28:58 multitude of Bitcoin miners to play an important role in the security of the 29:03 world. 29:05 And so, 29:07 that's what we're going to be talking about today. 29:10 So, 29:12 I'm going to be talking about the sidechains that are more peer-to-peer, and 29:15 then I'm going to be talking about the sidechains that are more resilient, and 29:20 then I'm going to be talking about the sidechains that are more peer-to-peer. 29:23 And so, 29:23 I'm going to be talking about the sidechains that are more peer-to-peer, and 29:27 then I'm going to be talking about the sidechains that are more peer-to-peer. 29:30 And so, 29:30 I'm going to be talking about the sidechains that are more peer-to-peer, and 29:33 then I'm going to be talking about the sidechains that are more peer-to-peer. 29:36 And so, 29:36 I'm going to be talking about the sidechains that are more peer-to-peer, and 29:39 then I'm going to be talking about the sidechains that are more peer-to-peer. 29:42 And so, 29:42 accrues value because it's -to -peer in 29:48 native sidechain technology like 29:53 Drivechain would accrue more value probably than sidechains that Bitcoin 29:59 currently has. it's 30:01 a very exciting upgrade for Bitcoin. 30:10 And it could be coming this year, maybe. 30:15 Drivechain is really on track, a lot more interest and attention and discussion on 30:20 it than in the past. 30:24 This is a great time to be interested in Drivechain as many people are promoting it as 30:30 a scaling solution for Bitcoin. 30:37 And who knows if these fees 30:39 will stay high or go back down. 30:44 But that is not the rationale for Drivechain. 30:50 The security budget problem is exciting and interesting, but it is not the 30:56 fundamental case for Drivechain. 30:57 In fact, when Drag Chain 30:59 was initially conceived, people weren't talking about the security budget. 31:04 Drivechain was designed originally in 2015, 31:09 our common contemporary understanding of the security budget arose in 2018, 31:14 when Jordan McKinney wrote 31:18 his three -part essay on the security budget on his blog, which Paul 31:24 links to in Paul's initial security budget essay written in 2019. 31:31 Jordan coins the term security budget in that blog post that he wrote. 31:38 he also coins the term security factor. 31:43 The security budget is the amount of value received by the miners on -chain. 31:48 Their fees plus the Coinbase. 31:50 But the security factor is the ratio between the security budget and the market cap of 31:54 Bitcoin. 31:56 A lot of people think it would be fine if fees rise just enough to offset the 32:02 diminution of the subsidy. 32:04 But in fact, that would cause the security budget to be constant. 32:11 And if the market cap of Bitcoin is rising over time, then 32:15 we would have a falling security factor. 32:19 So, 32:22 Lyn Alden understands this same dynamic. 32:25 She doesn't use the term security budget or security factor, but in her essay of March 32:29 2021 on Bitcoin fee modeling, Lyn Alden correctly describes 32:35 this, and she suggests that total security spending of about 1.5 32:41 % might be best for Bitcoin in the long run. 32:44 So if Bitcoin achieves a value of $1 trillion of market cap, then every 32:49 year the total miner income ideally would be about one and a half 32:54 trillion per year? 32:58 In other words, Bitcoin should spend around 1 % or more of its total value every year 33:03 on security, 33:06 the maintenance of the monetary system. 33:12 Seems 33:13 reasonable. 33:20 the fundamental case for Drivechain wasn't originally about security budget, and when 33:25 fees are high, an equally profound case can be made in the name of scaling as opposed 33:31 to security budget. 33:35 enabling more throughput, more peer -to -peer onboarding, more non -custodial onboarding 33:43 for Bitcoiners is necessary when fees are high. 33:50 So security budget is 33:51 not the major, not the most fundamental case that you can make for Drivechain. 33:56 A more fundamental case has to do with the fact that Drivechain enables greater 34:01 innovation. 34:03 This is the way that Mike Tidwell and Adam Back talk about Drivechain. 34:08 It's not about the security budget. 34:09 To them, it's mainly about 34:10 innovation, 34:13 Bitcoin to be a platform for creativity, experimentation, and innovation. 34:19 scientific laboratory of in economics and software. 34:25 So Mr. Bedtime, that is the case for Drivechain. 34:28 It's about innovation first and foremost. 34:32 another way of looking at it, another dimension with which to understand drivechain is 34:37 the way that Paul would say, is it's about handling disagreements 34:43 in the Bitcoin community in a way that doesn't. 34:46 lead to fracturing of the community. 34:50 people have disagreements over what the blockchain should be. 34:53 Drivechain allows people to experiment and develop and create value 34:59 for themselves and others on sidechains rather than arguing over what the main chain 35:03 should look like. 35:07 It's about handling and resolving disagreements while keeping people 35:13 together. It solves, as the economists would say, solves a coordination problem. 35:23 So, it's not just about the security 35:24 budget. The security budget is a subset or a symptom of 35:29 the more fundamental issue, which is about disagreements and innovation. 35:36 People want to create new things, but they don't want to have to get approval from the 35:39 whole community all the time. 35:42 And the blockchain can't be two 35:43 different things at once. 35:44 can't have large blocks and small blocks at the same time. 35:47 The solution, of course, is Drivechain, where the large blockers and the small blockers 35:51 can get along because they're using different blockchains with a common unit of 35:56 account. 35:58 So that is what Drivechain is all about. 36:01 You have the sidechain 36:02 and the mainchain, so two separate blockchains, 36:06 but a single set of 21 million. 36:12 What do you think? 36:14 Are you convinced? 36:15 You said it was mainly about the security budget for you. 36:18 I used to think the same thing, but now I see 36:21 that there's a deeper argument. 36:31 Well, mean, 36:33 I kind of thought it was a given in our conversation about like the innovation and 36:38 stuff. I'm 36:40 on RSK because I need expressive smart contracts. 36:43 yeah, 100%. Also I want a privacy layer on Bitcoin. 36:49 That's one thing I always tell people who are critical of Drivechain when they first 36:53 hear about it. 36:55 It's just like, yeah, you like Monero and Ring signature? 36:58 We could have 36:59 a Bitcoin version of that a drivechain so it could be actual Bitcoin you could trust 37:03 it because you know you could you know get back to the main chain and then they kind of 37:09 start thinking about it because you know as Bitcoin maxes everyone just kind of need 37:12 jerk reaction dismisses any innovation at all on Bitcoin 37:26 Well said. 37:32 Well, 37:38 What kind of numbers of people are involved in the RSK community? 37:43 Can you give me a sense of what you're aware of? 37:47 I can speak more. 37:49 I there's 600 plus active members of the sovereign community. 37:55 and I mean 38:01 that's where I'm most active on RSK but there 38:07 are there's guy Stan the Great is building an 38:13 NFT marketplace 38:14 on RSK that's also going to have ordinals and stuff. 38:20 that's exciting to see. 38:22 And I believe he was actually one of OG sovereign guys. 38:28 Started building some other projects, left for a while, and is bringing another 38:33 project back to RSK so that's exciting to see especially for me because I've got like 38:39 an NFT fun little thing on there and there's nowhere to buy them or trade them 38:45 or stuff and honestly right now you can't even see them in the block explorer because 38:49 you can't verify a contract on there but that's all 38:52 changing very shortly. 38:54 There's lots of upgrades coming to the usability, the UI, 39:00 UX, for different apps and stuff on RSK. 39:03 excited to see that. 39:05 Cool. 39:10 Well... 39:28 Usually, run the chain Twitter Spaces in the morning. 39:32 Today, we're having an evening, late night drivechain Twitter Space. 39:40 Is that why you joined? 39:42 it's bedtime? 39:45 Yeah! 39:47 Yeah, I'm not up in the morning. 39:50 Yeah, I get like a whole different crowd. 39:52 This late night Twitter space, it's a whole different vibe. 39:58 So Drivechain is probably going to come around on Bitcoin for one of the following 40:02 reasons. 40:04 So one 40:05 reason is love of innovation. 40:09 People might just start loving innovation. 40:13 And then they'll just want to have Drivechain. 40:16 Another reason is that there could be the fees are too high. 40:20 People want to scale Bitcoin. 40:23 Another reason is 40:24 the fees are too low and they want to get more security budget from merge mining. 40:31 then another reason is the so -called flippening, which is where Ethereum's market 40:37 cap surpasses Bitcoins, 40:41 causing fear and 40:42 loathing within the Bitcoin community and people want to something to stop 40:48 that and reverse it. 40:50 they'll embrace Drivechain for that reason. 40:53 So those are four reasons why Drivechain might be adopted. 40:56 Another one is the consensus upgrade ossification problem 41:01 where people want to do changes to Bitcoin to improve it, but they also want to have 41:06 ossification for purposes of stability and and 41:12 So they want to stop making changes, but they want to keep on developing. 41:20 So that's like the fifth reason they might do Drivechain, is if everyone realizes that 41:25 ossification would be good, but also development and creativity are good. 41:29 However, that fifth reason is probably the most complex of all five. 41:33 So it's unlikely that'll be the reason. 41:36 Now all of these reasons are good reasons 41:38 to adopt Drivechain. 41:40 However, I do believe that... 41:45 Well, let's say... 41:48 I guess the last one, the consensus upgrade ossification problem, that reason I think 41:53 would be like the Paul Sztorc reason. 41:55 Because when he says people 41:56 disagree about what the blockchain should be, that's what Drivechain is designed 42:02 to ameliorate or alleviate is this disagreement, this friction within 42:08 the community. I think what he means there is the same thing as what we mean when we 42:13 say the consensus 42:15 slash upgrade slash ossification problem. 42:20 I guess reason number five would be his favorite reason. 42:23 But I feel that love of innovation, the Adam Back, Mike Tidwell innovation idea. 42:29 I just say it's I refer to them because I have all these different 42:33 tweets I've collected from what people have said about Drivechain and 42:39 those two people talk about innovation in a nice way. 42:44 Other people have other reasons why they like it. 42:46 Like you like it because of the fees and security budget. 42:49 There's a few people who also think the same thing in my list. 42:52 My list, by the way, 42:55 at drivechain.info forward slash friends. 42:59 That's drivechain.info forward slash friends. 43:05 It's a Google document that has this list I made. 43:10 So 43:10 which of those things do you think will ultimately cause Drivechain to be adopted? 43:13 Will it be love of innovation, 43:18 fees being too high, 43:20 fees being too low, 43:24 or the consensus 43:29 upgrade, ossification problem, or is it flippening? 43:33 Which of those five? 43:38 Consensus upgrade, ossification due to fear of 43:43 AI. 43:46 for you. 43:49 Because in the future, we're gonna see chains come up that have like fully AI 43:54 optimized like base languages that are gonna make no sense 44:00 to you or I or any other thing that's ever been. 44:04 It's gonna be why. 44:05 AI was 44:05 not one of my five things. 44:11 Fear of just super hyper accelerated innovation driven by 44:17 AI and so they're going to need to ossify the Bitcoin main layer, have some thin layers 44:22 that these crazy AI things. 44:25 if AI were making blockchains, would have Drivechain already. 44:33 we'll get ready for the year of is going to be good. 44:35 is not very smart because I asked the AI if Bitcoin should do 44:41 Drivechain, and it was very unsure. 44:45 I don't think AI has yet to like really take the time to read Paul's blog. 44:51 mean, anyone who reads it will be immediately converted into Drivechainization support, 44:58 but many people don't. 45:02 And that AI might be no exception. 45:10 Well, we've covered a lot today. 45:12 This has been a fascinating conversation. 45:14 It has been a pleasure to talk with you, Mr. 45:17 Bedtime. 45:19 You as well. 45:23 Oh, I didn't catch that last thing you said. 45:27 Oh, just you as well. 45:28 This is hula vu blue with .rsk, the other guy, listening. 45:33 I just have this on my phone. 45:36 wait, this is a fascinating revelation. 45:39 You're saying you're not Mr. 45:40 Bedtime, you're actually hula vu? 45:41 cool 45:44 Yeah, Hoolavoo Blue is me, but Bedtime Labs is my little... 45:50 my project company name. 45:52 Oh, so you actually have... 45:54 You actually have two identities. 45:56 Two? Two men. 45:58 Yeah, two men in the same... 46:00 Yeah. No, I just have the 46:02 bedtime labs going on my phone so I could actually talk on the microphone. 46:05 thought you pulled up on my computer on my account. 46:07 I see. So I thought there were four people here. 46:12 There's actually only three. 46:14 Yes. see. 46:17 is like overstating the number of people. 46:22 is like when Twitter had all those users and it turned out they were all bots and then 46:25 Elon tried to back out of the deal yes 46:30 indeed well how do you know I'm not training in AI with one of these fans right now I 46:36 mean you trained in AI using me that wouldn't be a 46:41 good idea. 46:43 I would find someone else to train the AI on. 46:51 Well, this has been a nice conversation. 46:53 Thank you for joining. 46:54 Thank you for your questions. 46:56 I hope to see you again soon. 46:57 This has been Drivechain Twitter Spaces. 47:00 We meet 47:00 every Monday and Thursday to discuss Bitcoin Improvement Proposal 300 and 301, 47:07 a potentially transformative upgrade to bring advanced sidechains to Bitcoin, advanced 47:12 sidechains for scaling, privacy, DNS, smart contracts, and 47:18 many other fascinating 47:25 I'll catch you all next time, specifically on Monday. 47:34 Have a good evening.
